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RNG is streaky, fail twice/thrice in a row then wait till next time. I tend to wait until I start noticing a minor streak of luck; rare drops, low es enchanting, etc. I used to roll the dice in big loads like you, and I noticed results would considerably lean towards a strong positive or negative.
Also, may be different players have different inherent luck values? I have one friend who has one of the most horrendous rng history I've ever witnessed, and another that's practically showered by rare drops and insane gear every week. Idk.
coding in a higher chance of failing repeatedly would cause more players to keep trying due to gambler's fallacy and the phenomenon of going "on tilt" and therefore spend more money on runes.
Or it would cause them to give up and move to another game, because those who still play know that you don't get scrolled gear or a high enhance by failing every single thing ever.
But that's exactly what management currently believes is the way to go. And, apparently, it's doing pretty great in discouraging non MasterCard players from the game and keeping those who love shiny pixels earned through bruteforcing RNG with loads of $$$.
Sadly that's the way they intended it and I'm afraid noone can do anything about it, even in Korea. As much as paying real money for an enchant rune, which can still break if the scroll fails is disgusting, the only real thing we can do is be smart about it and use events and free gifts to our advantage. But since for them it has always worked to milk a few players why would they stop?
Because, with all due respect, if they keep the current system then BDO steals their customers. The sad part is, more people are definitely playing BDO even tho BDO's combat system is so much worse than Vindictus. Just mindless spamming evades while attacking in PvE and whoever gets the first CC wins in 1v1 PvP as an example.
All the Vindictus Devs would have to do is adapt BDO's enhancement system tbh or SOMETHING SIMILAR (Doesn't have to be the same exact blueprints), they could still profit. I mean if BDO is going to rip off of Cestus Karok with Giant's 2nd awakening: Iron Buster, devcat or whoever the dev is for this game may as well do the same.
Pretty sad that a game with actual better combat is doing so much worse than a badly designed combat system like BDO.
It should be a permament feature, not an event thing.
It's fine as a seasonal reward as long as they keep up events like double cores/bonus raids/unlimited revs and mix them all in together. Sometimes the extra rewards from raiding that way allow you to buy more scrolls and such if someone else gets them and the scrolls are at a lower price, or to buy pre-enchanted items. The scroll shop gives a bit of offset for people who have just had horrendous RNG and at least allows them to get guaranteed returns for farming raids daily.
TERA makes it so that the rate is ridiculously low as you go higher in enhancement, and BDO does so as well with the possibility of enhancement level loss in a certain range and then complete item loss above a certain level if you choose to risk it. Vindi can offer a pretty viable system of its own if they keep the rewards regular here the same way they do in Asia. Knowing that you can replace an entire weapon with a bit of time farming or that you will get a chance to try enchanting/enhancing somewhat regularly until you succeed will definitely keep a lot more people around than knowing that months of work will be gone in a flash with no viable recourse that can be attained on your own.
Keeping the game active encourages the casual players to keep coming back and spend a little here and there, other players to spend a bit more money regularly, and the whales incentive to stick around as well. Brutal RNG at every turn just makes the game poo for everyone. There are still some tweaks that could help, but if they keep things like this and give players a way to offset the RNG a bit and encourage both maxing out a character or two and being able to have viable alts then Vindi can mostly keep sailing along.
Still, we'll see. If Bless has a good job done on its combat revamp and KUF2 ever actually shows up there are definitely other titles that will be worth spending time on as well just to mix things up. I hope Vindi's staff keeps in mind that customers should be treated well and be treated well consistently.
It's 40% per enchant. If you think that you will succeed 4 out of 10 enchants just because that's the chance for an individual enchant then you might even deserve that fail.
Except that's exactly how probabilities work. Where were you in 7th grade?
Step 1
Suppose you're given the following problem: Jimmy has a bag of enchant scrolls, and he has a 40 percent chance of succeeding an enchantment. Then he enchants 10 time individually (which is equal to drawing a marble and returning it back into the bag 10 times). You're asked how many times should he succeed in enchanting out of 10 times?
Step 2
Look at the problem to find how many attempts were made at the event. In this case, Jimmy tried to enchant 10 times, so 10 attempts were made.
Step 3
Multiply the number of attempts by the percent probability in decimal form. The answer will be the number of times the event should occur. In the example, 10 x 0.4 = 4, so Jimmy should succeed in enchanting four out of the 10 times he tries to enchant.
You're welcome. Also don't be going around correcting people if you don't know what you're talking about. That's rude and reflects badly on you.
But like I mentioned earlier, when it comes to small numbers it tends to fluctuate a lot so it's obviously not something you should count on.
As for those who keep talking about how DevCat\Nexon should feel threatened because of BDO or Bless or whatnot. They don't. What you fail to realize is that games like Vindi hold a monopoly on what they do. There is no other game out there that's remotely close to what Vindi does. There could be 100 BDOs out there and Vindi would still be doing its own niche thing. You're not the target audience of what Nexon\DevCat are going for, the whales who like the niche of Vindi are. And Nexon knows damn well those whales are not going anywhere anytime soon, because there is no other game like Vindi. They can go to BDO, but Nexon knows they'll come back crawling for Vindi whenever there's a new update.
When you hold a monopoly over a niche genre, you don't even have to try.
The same thing happened in S4 League. It was acquired by Aeria game, and not sure how many of you know Aeria games, but they be greedy. Very greedy. They didn't even wait one day to start milking the game dry. But guess what? It worked. You know why? Because just like Vindi, S4 League was a niche game that held a monopoly over what it did (the only competition was a game called GunZ, but that game got shut down). For those of you who are wondering, Aeria are still milking this game till today. It's been nearly 3 years (and the game is 9 years old in total).
I'm not defending Nexon, I'm just being realistic. Nothing will change until there's a true competition for Vindi. And no, BDO is not competition as they're not competing over the same target audience. Black Desert is competition for games in the field of open-world sandbox, not so much for niche games such as Monster Hunter or Vindi.
And inb4 you come in with your anecdotal evidence about how you saw whales leaving the game. It's true. S4 League has had it too. 3 years ago S4 League had 2000 concurrent players and more whales than it has today. I bet Vindi had more whales back in 2015 than it has today too. BUT, it doesn't matter, because both games are peer-2-peer so the upkeep costs are very minimal. So even when they gradually lose whales over the years, they still make mad profits. And in Nexon's case, they're branching into the mobile gaming market, so clearly they have plan B's and couldn't care less if Vindi runs out of whales someday in the future.
Bottom line is. I really doubt Nexon\DevCat are bothered by BDO, Bless or whatever.
Edit: I've seen how Aeria managed their special gem, and no matter how many fancy shooter titles were released, Aeria were NotBothered.com. And I can see the same thing with DevCat\Nexon, they don't seem to be threatened by BDO or any of that.
Half of Neamhain's sound effects are recycled (Keaghan's swing sounds, Kai's explosive sounds, Siglint's thunder sounds, Havan's fist stomping sounds and the Dark Knight second transformation sounds). It's basically a recycled Iset raid with Havan being a giant crab-lobster. They recycled trash mobs and sound effects in the new icy chapter as well.
Not sure if it's just me being overly-observant, but it's pretty clear to me that DevCat are not even trying. And if they can afford to not even try when there are games like BDO around than they're clearly NotBothered.com
Also Black Desert has recently released a waifu class. What has DevCat done? Nothing.
Did I already say NotBothered.com?
So, yeah, I'll have to disagree with ya'll saying DevCat\Nexon are threatened by anything.
"Now 40% means that out of 10 attempts 6 would fail and 4 would succeed"
" Of course when you're dealing with such small number it can fluctuate like failing 8 times and succeeding only 2 or failing 5 times and succeeding 5 times."
Oh look, you disputed your own words. Bravo
Now to further disprove your useless attempt at being an @ss, you DO NOT have 6 blue balls (signifying failure) and 4 red balls (signifying success) in one bag.
What you instead have, is a simple bag with one ball inside, but you can't see what's inside.
"But like I mentioned earlier, when it comes to small numbers it tends to fluctuate a lot so it's obviously not something you should count on."
Small numbers? You're literally saying that 4 enchants out of 10 should work. Because that's how probability works for a SINGLE enchant, amirite?
Tell me again how you will always enchant 4 times after failing 16 times in a row .
Small numbers? You're literally saying that 4 enchants out of 10 should work. Because that's how probability works for a SINGLE enchant, amirite?
No I didn't, you're just putting words in my mouth because I called you out and now you're just trying to twist your way out of it. 4 out of 10 is how probabilities work ON PAPER when you calculate them using what you learned in 7th grade. IN REAL LIFE it can fluctuate especially when you're dealing with small numbers. What's the problem? Where's the contradiction? That's just how statistics, probabilities and chances work. They're never 100% to what they are when you calculate them on paper. Did you really just take the 4 out of 10 at face value? Clearly I never said you should take it at face value when I followed up explaining how results may vary in real life, which you conveniently decided to bring up only AFTER I called you out.
Now to further disprove your useless attempt at being an @ss, you DO NOT have 6 blue balls (signifying failure) and 4 red balls (signifying success) in one bag. What you instead have, is a simple bag with one ball inside, but you can't see what's inside.
It's cute how you call me a "useless ass" when you're the one who came for me in the first place, trying to correct something that wasn't even wrong.
Secondly, "a simple bag with one ball"? How would you even code such thing? What are you even talking about?
The most common method to code RNG is using the "marble in a sack method". You program a bunch of numbers, let's say from 1 to 102. The first 40 numbers (1-41) signify success and the latter 60 numbers (42-102) signify fail. Then you program a random number generator that will generate a random number between 1 and 102. If it falls on any number between 1-41, you get a success. If it falls on any number between 42-102, you fail. Of course I'm not saying it's exactly what DevCat are using for their RNG programs but the "marble in the sack" method (and its variations) is a lot more common than whatever it is you made up over there.
Seriously, you're trying to come for me and correct me but you just come off as uneducated and rude. I'm done.
Yeah that sounds about right I guess. If DevCat doesn't wanna change things around that's fine, it's their game and I guess playing it safe with +10-+15 coupons, spare weapons + AP resurrections is the norm for now.
But I'm also sure that DevCat wants the cash as well along with the things that they are already profiting from as you said. BDO has been successful even tho the game is so badly designed and I honestly believe their version of upgrading has a big part in it. Even tho BDO has a different target audience, I think the same principles can apply to Vindictus because it gives DevCat options to milk even more cash. Let's say they changed it to where items stopped breaking from enchanting (Just lose maybe 50 durability or so) or enhancing over +8 (And every time you fail you lose a good amount of durability, more than right now. From attempts to +1 to +8 item levels don't go back to 0 but after attempts FROM +9 to +15 goes down 1 level every time you fail; cannot go below +8 so enhancement runes are still viable for attempts at +9 to +11. Your weapon goes back to +11 [when you can't use enhance runes anymore] when you fail an attempt to +13, back to +12 when failing an attempt to +14 while losing A LOT of durability). If your durability reaches 0 then your weapon/armor simply cannot be used.
Then they can just add cash items that triple/quadruple your durability restoration for example. That doesn't sound like a bad deal. Doesn't have to be my exact idea either because I'm pretty sure I'm overlooking a bunch of other things.
Of course I just gave an example, a rough draft. But I'm sure they can milk more cash by scrapping the weapon breaking mechanic with a better system. They want the cash, they can get more of it.
If their blueprints are hard to calibrate tho that's a different story.
Ok, since you're going to be acting like a child, I'll have to explain it to you like a child.
This is how you think enchanting works in this game: In one bag you have 4 good balls, and 6 bad balls. The chance to pick a good ball is 40%. If you pick out every single ball you will have 4 good balls and 6 bad balls. This is obviously wrong because in this scenario a scroll either has 0% chance to succeed (being a bad ball), or it has 100% (being its counterpart, the good ball). Hence you thinking that 4 of them will succeed out of 10.
This is how enchanting ACTUALLY works in the game: In one bag you have 10 balls. 4 good ones, and 6 bad ones. If you pick out a good one the scroll succeeds.
It's not hard if you're not a complete re tard
I will not go into the topic of how RNG influences which ball gets actually picked out because for what you were saying it's irrelevant.
"you're just putting words in my mouth"
>>>>>Now 40% means that out of 10 attempts 6 would fail and 4 would succeed.
YOLO your first r7 scroll. Your runes will be used to protect the armor while putting the 2nd enchant on. I suggest starting with the chest/tunic since most people are good with master ES it makes it the easiest set piece to finish. If you want to keep making a progress I suggest trying to nail the first r7 on all 5 pieces first and then circling back around with runes saved over time.
Made the most sense here (as I said earlier aswell). Yet nobody will read it while its the best tip ever, because u write with too much text.
Of course I just gave an example, a rough draft. But I'm sure they can milk more cash by scrapping the weapon breaking mechanic with a better system. They want the cash, they can get more of it.
If their blueprints are hard to calibrate tho that's a different story.
Maybe they're going with the old school of thought that "if we make it easier\less RNG, whales will spend less money". Maybe they don't think that cushioning the RNG in the game will yield (more) profits. All I can say is DevCat seem pretty comfortable with where they at now, whether we as western players like it or not. They don't seem to be bothered enough to change anything.
Yes i think the same its half to half . To be honest i dont know why so many problems with enhancement . In my case its work on first time if not then at third try wirks for sure . I dont run with precentage even . Doubt its important if you got 25 bars or 98 because im not failing even with 25 . Maybe im just lucker or brynn loves me
I know I'm beating a dead horse here, but whatever.
I've been playing off and on since beta, and I've always returned to this game because I just love the combat. With the Delia release I've been playing a lot more since she's so fun, so I've been actually putting some effort into getting some actual end game gear. I did all the events, farmed the gold, got the orange items, then tried enchanting with the runes I got from the events......
Failed. Every single time. Even with 95+ br. Just repeatedly failed, over and over again. Even spent a little money to get an extra attempt, just to fail again and exhaust my resources.
It's like all that time I spent grinding meant absolutely nothing. All that effort made pointless in 5 minutes time. It's incredibly discouraging to people like me who aren't at the end-game already. I'm reminded why I keep getting pushed away from this game.
/qq
Literally the main reason why people stop playing this game is the RNG.
Pretty sad that a game with actual better combat is doing so much worse than a badly designed combat system like BDO.
idk why you all say is badly designed, you ever played whit end game armor and awakening? honestly I would never change Witch awakening combat system with the evie one..evie feels slow, even whit 80 atk spd, I can not move sideways, I can not jump, i can not move backwards, etc Witch has like 10x the sklls i have on my evie and i can switch betwen 2 weapon during the battle /do combo between them,etc i have 8 keys setted on my keyboard /mouse /12 quick slots lol
I know I'm beating a dead horse here, but whatever.
I've been playing off and on since beta, and I've always returned to this game because I just love the combat. With the Delia release I've been playing a lot more since she's so fun, so I've been actually putting some effort into getting some actual end game gear. I did all the events, farmed the gold, got the orange items, then tried enchanting with the runes I got from the events......
Failed. Every single time. Even with 95+ br. Just repeatedly failed, over and over again. Even spent a little money to get an extra attempt, just to fail again and exhaust my resources.
It's like all that time I spent grinding meant absolutely nothing. All that effort made pointless in 5 minutes time. It's incredibly discouraging to people like me who aren't at the end-game already. I'm reminded why I keep getting pushed away from this game.
/qq
Literally the main reason why people stop playing this game is the RNG.
Least it's NOT as bad as losing a rank for failing, and/or booming as you press [craft]...
Pretty sad that a game with actual better combat is doing so much worse than a badly designed combat system like BDO.
idk why you all say is badly designed, you ever played whit end game armor and awakening? honestly I would never change Witch awakening combat system with the evie one..evie feels slow, even whit 80 atk spd, I can not move sideways, I can not jump, i can not move backwards, etc Witch has like 10x the sklls i have on my evie and i can switch betwen 2 weapon during the battle /do combo between them,etc i have 8 keys setted on my keyboard /mouse /12 quick slots lol
At least Evie has to time dodges even tho it's one of the easier classes. Wizard/Witch kills people in .5 seconds in PvP (Where the skill floor/cap should matter) and can literally escape people.
Like don't get me wrong, every class can 100-0 in BDO. Thing is, Vindictus has "some" build variety, actual sustain damage, and you have to time evades. But in BDO if you don't build AP and play for the burst you put yourself at a disadvantage because "any other type of build" will just slow your farm. You get away by doing bad habits because literally most of your skills have iframes and super armor. And because there is so much DESYNC, iframes and super armor? The only viable build and playstyle in BDO is AP and kill the guy in 1 CC and within 10 SECONDS and this goes the same for ALL CLASSES no matter which class you pick in BDO.
In Vindictus, if I wanted to play a memorization + endurance game where I need to know which smash comes next after the first [space > right click] and the next ones, I'll play Hurk. If I want to test my reaction time to the fullest, I'll play Spear Lann. BDO has NO VARIETY in terms of COMBAT. And there is almost no counter argument to that. The Farmville Part (where the variety is "how you make money") is the only thing BDO has going for it and that got boring.
There is no sustain damage meta in PvP where people die within a reasonable amount of time at a minimum of 30 seconds and maximum 5 minutes.
And World Bosses compared to Vindictus bosses? They're braindead easy, no joke. My 100 AP 100 DP Valkyrie could probably do Kutum and never die for if I was half awake, for example and that's with absolute trash gear.
You can say that BDO is a PvP game and Vindictus is a PvE game, and are two different games, sure. But it doesn't change how "bad play" is most of the time never punished in BDO and that PvP is almost a socialist environment where even the "worst type of player" can succeed due to how BDO is a medium skill-floor low skill ceiling game. You play bad in Vindictus, bosses destroy you.
Pretty sad that a game with actual better combat is doing so much worse than a badly designed combat system like BDO.
idk why you all say is badly designed, you ever played whit end game armor and awakening? honestly I would never change Witch awakening combat system with the evie one..evie feels slow, even whit 80 atk spd, I can not move sideways, I can not jump, i can not move backwards, etc Witch has like 10x the sklls i have on my evie and i can switch betwen 2 weapon during the battle /do combo between them,etc i have 8 keys setted on my keyboard /mouse /12 quick slots lol
At least Evie has to time dodges even tho it's one of the easier classes. Wizard/Witch kills people in .5 seconds in PvP (Where the skill floor/cap should matter) and can literally escape people.
Like don't get me wrong, every class can 100-0 in BDO. Thing is, Vindictus has "some" build variety, actual sustain damage, and you have to time evades. But in BDO if you don't build AP and play for the burst you put yourself at a disadvantage because "any other type of build" will just slow your farm. You get away by doing bad habits because literally most of your skills have iframes and super armor. And because there is so much DESYNC, iframes and super armor? The only viable build and playstyle in BDO is AP and kill the guy in 1 CC and within 10 SECONDS and this goes the same for ALL CLASSES no matter which class you pick in BDO.
In Vindictus, if I wanted to play a memorization + endurance game where I need to know which smash comes next after the first [space > right click] and the next ones, I'll play Hurk. If I want to test my reaction time to the fullest, I'll play Spear Lann. BDO has NO VARIETY in terms of COMBAT. And there is almost no counter argument to that. The Farmville Part (where the variety is "how you make money") is the only thing BDO has going for it and that got boring.
There is no sustain damage meta in PvP where people die within a reasonable amount of time at a minimum of 30 seconds and maximum 5 minutes.
And World Bosses compared to Vindictus bosses? They're braindead easy, no joke. My 100 AP 100 DP Valkyrie could probably do Kutum and never die for if I was half awake, for example and that's with absolute trash gear.
You can say that BDO is a PvP game and Vindictus is a PvE game, and are two different games, sure. But it doesn't change how "bad play" is most of the time never punished in BDO and that PvP is almost a socialist environment where even the "worst type of player" can succeed due to how BDO is a medium skill-floor low skill ceiling game. You play bad in Vindictus, bosses destroy you.
Ye, perfect, amazing, etc I know how beautiful and sparkling Vindi bosses are, I played there five years, meanwhile you are stuck doing the same dungeon every day and when you understand the mechanics of the boss is only boring dailie rootine, open dungeon , kill, open another dungeon, kill..if you die you get revived and start over doing the same skill rotation, dodge etc
You can decorated it with bows, super combat system (i doubt is that good in comparison) but it is always lacking something..
btw i like bdo, what can i do? most of the things you said are BS like the one we don't have to dodge o.o , 1 cc, that probably an ultimate skill which u can't spam, but fine, if u can't press dodge or block in time your problem, idk what u talking about for the rest. I like being op, that op wiz is were i'm aiming, killing a bunch of player like that is a true aspiration
Anyway back to the topic, vindi need a system where you can farm back the dura and items does not get destroyed upon fail so RNG does not matter that much..thing they will never do, matter closed.
It's a crappy game with an even crappier battle system. Its only saving grace is that as a life skilling game (think Runescape) it can be somewhat entertaining to set farming or whatever and then alt-tab out and play another game. Requiring very little actual time input for gains in that regard.
The PvP is literally nothing but cc/100-0 where it's a skill point and equipment check. There is no player skill involved at all. You could probably write a 2 key press macro to PvP for you in BDO.
The PvE is even worse. As stated, world bosses are just like all the other MMORPGs. Sit there and press 123451234512345. It's a gear check. If your gear is good enough to survive and win, you win. If it's not, you die. Simple as that. Meanwhile, in Vindictus, you can solo Regina with 19k attack on an Arisha if you're good. Or you can do it with 28k attack if you're good also. But if you're bad, no amount of attack is going to let you win (remember the time Zoltar tried to fight Muir with practically unlimited goddess graces but then he gave up instead because he couldn't do it, go check it out, should probably still be on twitch somewhere).
If you like BDO and you play it then good on you. But there's no denying that the game is dead. It's Vindictus level dead, and it's much newer than Vindictus is.
=========
For Black Desert to have succeeded it needed to have faster and much more sublime battle system, much in line with how Vindictus is. Intersperse it with more skills or skill combos if you want.
Make PvP combat more like an actual fighting game so you can utilize those combos while maintaining the increased speed of combat.
Literally take the pages of boss combat out of Vindictus' playbook. Speed the bosses up a bit and vary their attack patterns and hazards more to match the faster paced combat.
Then incorporate Warframe style gear progression.
Coupled with its graphics and openworld content and lifeskilling? That would've made BDO the ultimate MMORPG and I'd pay 50 bucks a month just to play it as well as more through a cash shop for aesthetics with regard to outfitters and convenience items.
If you like BDO and you play it then good on you. But there's no denying that the game is dead. It's Vindictus level dead, and it's much newer than Vindictus is.
lvl of BS has reach insane lvls today, I play every day and this is the scenario I witness on every world bosses / event over 36 channels on evening, if you call this "dead" , p,s there are 3800 ppls conneted right now on bdo forum (these are just the number of people logged on forum,) go check.
on an estination how many ppls vindi got? probably less than just the amount of ppls logged on bdo forum at prime time, cmn
Yes i think the same its half to half . To be honest i dont know why so many problems with enhancement . In my case its work on first time if not then at third try wirks for sure . I dont run with precentage even . Doubt its important if you got 25 bars or 98 because im not failing even with 25 . Maybe im just lucker or brynn loves me
I failed my lv 80 weapon from +4 to +5 4 times in a row (bought stones and tried again) and from +3 to +4 at least 3 times. It should be 75% chance. I know how pseudo-randomness works but the generator must be very lame because it doesn't generate a number between 0 and 75 in 5 minutes. Or even if it was between 0 and 750 the real world chance that it generates 75% would be pretty much the same.
As for enchants i haven't tried scrolls above RA since i came back in December. But even the scroll drops are heavily RNG so the overall chance that you can put a scroll on a weapon is quite low. It's not very casual-friendly. +cry
But at least i succeed more times with skill awakening on 25%'s.
Kommentare
Also, may be different players have different inherent luck values? I have one friend who has one of the most horrendous rng history I've ever witnessed, and another that's practically showered by rare drops and insane gear every week. Idk.
Because, with all due respect, if they keep the current system then BDO steals their customers. The sad part is, more people are definitely playing BDO even tho BDO's combat system is so much worse than Vindictus. Just mindless spamming evades while attacking in PvE and whoever gets the first CC wins in 1v1 PvP as an example.
All the Vindictus Devs would have to do is adapt BDO's enhancement system tbh or SOMETHING SIMILAR (Doesn't have to be the same exact blueprints), they could still profit. I mean if BDO is going to rip off of Cestus Karok with Giant's 2nd awakening: Iron Buster, devcat or whoever the dev is for this game may as well do the same.
Pretty sad that a game with actual better combat is doing so much worse than a badly designed combat system like BDO.
It's fine as a seasonal reward as long as they keep up events like double cores/bonus raids/unlimited revs and mix them all in together. Sometimes the extra rewards from raiding that way allow you to buy more scrolls and such if someone else gets them and the scrolls are at a lower price, or to buy pre-enchanted items. The scroll shop gives a bit of offset for people who have just had horrendous RNG and at least allows them to get guaranteed returns for farming raids daily.
TERA makes it so that the rate is ridiculously low as you go higher in enhancement, and BDO does so as well with the possibility of enhancement level loss in a certain range and then complete item loss above a certain level if you choose to risk it. Vindi can offer a pretty viable system of its own if they keep the rewards regular here the same way they do in Asia. Knowing that you can replace an entire weapon with a bit of time farming or that you will get a chance to try enchanting/enhancing somewhat regularly until you succeed will definitely keep a lot more people around than knowing that months of work will be gone in a flash with no viable recourse that can be attained on your own.
Keeping the game active encourages the casual players to keep coming back and spend a little here and there, other players to spend a bit more money regularly, and the whales incentive to stick around as well. Brutal RNG at every turn just makes the game poo for everyone. There are still some tweaks that could help, but if they keep things like this and give players a way to offset the RNG a bit and encourage both maxing out a character or two and being able to have viable alts then Vindi can mostly keep sailing along.
Still, we'll see. If Bless has a good job done on its combat revamp and KUF2 ever actually shows up there are definitely other titles that will be worth spending time on as well just to mix things up. I hope Vindi's staff keeps in mind that customers should be treated well and be treated well consistently.
Except that's exactly how probabilities work. Where were you in 7th grade?
Here, let's have Jimmy help you figure this out.
http://sciencing.com/calculate-probability-percentages-8245777.html
Step 1
Suppose you're given the following problem: Jimmy has a bag of enchant scrolls, and he has a 40 percent chance of succeeding an enchantment. Then he enchants 10 time individually (which is equal to drawing a marble and returning it back into the bag 10 times). You're asked how many times should he succeed in enchanting out of 10 times?
Step 2
Look at the problem to find how many attempts were made at the event. In this case, Jimmy tried to enchant 10 times, so 10 attempts were made.
Step 3
Multiply the number of attempts by the percent probability in decimal form. The answer will be the number of times the event should occur. In the example, 10 x 0.4 = 4, so Jimmy should succeed in enchanting four out of the 10 times he tries to enchant.
You're welcome. Also don't be going around correcting people if you don't know what you're talking about. That's rude and reflects badly on you.
But like I mentioned earlier, when it comes to small numbers it tends to fluctuate a lot so it's obviously not something you should count on.
As for those who keep talking about how DevCat\Nexon should feel threatened because of BDO or Bless or whatnot. They don't. What you fail to realize is that games like Vindi hold a monopoly on what they do. There is no other game out there that's remotely close to what Vindi does. There could be 100 BDOs out there and Vindi would still be doing its own niche thing. You're not the target audience of what Nexon\DevCat are going for, the whales who like the niche of Vindi are. And Nexon knows damn well those whales are not going anywhere anytime soon, because there is no other game like Vindi. They can go to BDO, but Nexon knows they'll come back crawling for Vindi whenever there's a new update.
When you hold a monopoly over a niche genre, you don't even have to try.
The same thing happened in S4 League. It was acquired by Aeria game, and not sure how many of you know Aeria games, but they be greedy. Very greedy. They didn't even wait one day to start milking the game dry. But guess what? It worked. You know why? Because just like Vindi, S4 League was a niche game that held a monopoly over what it did (the only competition was a game called GunZ, but that game got shut down). For those of you who are wondering, Aeria are still milking this game till today. It's been nearly 3 years (and the game is 9 years old in total).
I'm not defending Nexon, I'm just being realistic. Nothing will change until there's a true competition for Vindi. And no, BDO is not competition as they're not competing over the same target audience. Black Desert is competition for games in the field of open-world sandbox, not so much for niche games such as Monster Hunter or Vindi.
And inb4 you come in with your anecdotal evidence about how you saw whales leaving the game. It's true. S4 League has had it too. 3 years ago S4 League had 2000 concurrent players and more whales than it has today. I bet Vindi had more whales back in 2015 than it has today too. BUT, it doesn't matter, because both games are peer-2-peer so the upkeep costs are very minimal. So even when they gradually lose whales over the years, they still make mad profits. And in Nexon's case, they're branching into the mobile gaming market, so clearly they have plan B's and couldn't care less if Vindi runs out of whales someday in the future.
Bottom line is. I really doubt Nexon\DevCat are bothered by BDO, Bless or whatever.
Edit: I've seen how Aeria managed their special gem, and no matter how many fancy shooter titles were released, Aeria were NotBothered.com. And I can see the same thing with DevCat\Nexon, they don't seem to be threatened by BDO or any of that.
Half of Neamhain's sound effects are recycled (Keaghan's swing sounds, Kai's explosive sounds, Siglint's thunder sounds, Havan's fist stomping sounds and the Dark Knight second transformation sounds). It's basically a recycled Iset raid with Havan being a giant crab-lobster. They recycled trash mobs and sound effects in the new icy chapter as well.
Not sure if it's just me being overly-observant, but it's pretty clear to me that DevCat are not even trying. And if they can afford to not even try when there are games like BDO around than they're clearly NotBothered.com
Also Black Desert has recently released a waifu class. What has DevCat done? Nothing.
Did I already say NotBothered.com?
So, yeah, I'll have to disagree with ya'll saying DevCat\Nexon are threatened by anything.
"Now 40% means that out of 10 attempts 6 would fail and 4 would succeed"
" Of course when you're dealing with such small number it can fluctuate like failing 8 times and succeeding only 2 or failing 5 times and succeeding 5 times."
Oh look, you disputed your own words. Bravo
Now to further disprove your useless attempt at being an @ss, you DO NOT have 6 blue balls (signifying failure) and 4 red balls (signifying success) in one bag.
What you instead have, is a simple bag with one ball inside, but you can't see what's inside.
"But like I mentioned earlier, when it comes to small numbers it tends to fluctuate a lot so it's obviously not something you should count on."
Small numbers? You're literally saying that 4 enchants out of 10 should work. Because that's how probability works for a SINGLE enchant, amirite?
Tell me again how you will always enchant 4 times after failing 16 times in a row .
No I didn't, you're just putting words in my mouth because I called you out and now you're just trying to twist your way out of it. 4 out of 10 is how probabilities work ON PAPER when you calculate them using what you learned in 7th grade. IN REAL LIFE it can fluctuate especially when you're dealing with small numbers. What's the problem? Where's the contradiction? That's just how statistics, probabilities and chances work. They're never 100% to what they are when you calculate them on paper. Did you really just take the 4 out of 10 at face value? Clearly I never said you should take it at face value when I followed up explaining how results may vary in real life, which you conveniently decided to bring up only AFTER I called you out.
It's cute how you call me a "useless ass" when you're the one who came for me in the first place, trying to correct something that wasn't even wrong.
Secondly, "a simple bag with one ball"? How would you even code such thing? What are you even talking about?
The most common method to code RNG is using the "marble in a sack method". You program a bunch of numbers, let's say from 1 to 102. The first 40 numbers (1-41) signify success and the latter 60 numbers (42-102) signify fail. Then you program a random number generator that will generate a random number between 1 and 102. If it falls on any number between 1-41, you get a success. If it falls on any number between 42-102, you fail. Of course I'm not saying it's exactly what DevCat are using for their RNG programs but the "marble in the sack" method (and its variations) is a lot more common than whatever it is you made up over there.
Seriously, you're trying to come for me and correct me but you just come off as uneducated and rude. I'm done.
But I'm also sure that DevCat wants the cash as well along with the things that they are already profiting from as you said. BDO has been successful even tho the game is so badly designed and I honestly believe their version of upgrading has a big part in it. Even tho BDO has a different target audience, I think the same principles can apply to Vindictus because it gives DevCat options to milk even more cash. Let's say they changed it to where items stopped breaking from enchanting (Just lose maybe 50 durability or so) or enhancing over +8 (And every time you fail you lose a good amount of durability, more than right now. From attempts to +1 to +8 item levels don't go back to 0 but after attempts FROM +9 to +15 goes down 1 level every time you fail; cannot go below +8 so enhancement runes are still viable for attempts at +9 to +11. Your weapon goes back to +11 [when you can't use enhance runes anymore] when you fail an attempt to +13, back to +12 when failing an attempt to +14 while losing A LOT of durability). If your durability reaches 0 then your weapon/armor simply cannot be used.
Then they can just add cash items that triple/quadruple your durability restoration for example. That doesn't sound like a bad deal. Doesn't have to be my exact idea either because I'm pretty sure I'm overlooking a bunch of other things.
Of course I just gave an example, a rough draft. But I'm sure they can milk more cash by scrapping the weapon breaking mechanic with a better system. They want the cash, they can get more of it.
If their blueprints are hard to calibrate tho that's a different story.
Ok, since you're going to be acting like a child, I'll have to explain it to you like a child.
This is how you think enchanting works in this game: In one bag you have 4 good balls, and 6 bad balls. The chance to pick a good ball is 40%. If you pick out every single ball you will have 4 good balls and 6 bad balls. This is obviously wrong because in this scenario a scroll either has 0% chance to succeed (being a bad ball), or it has 100% (being its counterpart, the good ball). Hence you thinking that 4 of them will succeed out of 10.
This is how enchanting ACTUALLY works in the game: In one bag you have 10 balls. 4 good ones, and 6 bad ones. If you pick out a good one the scroll succeeds.
It's not hard if you're not a complete re tard
I will not go into the topic of how RNG influences which ball gets actually picked out because for what you were saying it's irrelevant.
"you're just putting words in my mouth"
>>>>>Now 40% means that out of 10 attempts 6 would fail and 4 would succeed.
Oh well, I guess math is too hard for some people
Made the most sense here (as I said earlier aswell). Yet nobody will read it while its the best tip ever, because u write with too much text.
Maybe they're going with the old school of thought that "if we make it easier\less RNG, whales will spend less money". Maybe they don't think that cushioning the RNG in the game will yield (more) profits. All I can say is DevCat seem pretty comfortable with where they at now, whether we as western players like it or not. They don't seem to be bothered enough to change anything.
Literally the main reason why people stop playing this game is the RNG.
idk why you all say is badly designed, you ever played whit end game armor and awakening? honestly I would never change Witch awakening combat system with the evie one..evie feels slow, even whit 80 atk spd, I can not move sideways, I can not jump, i can not move backwards, etc Witch has like 10x the sklls i have on my evie and i can switch betwen 2 weapon during the battle /do combo between them,etc i have 8 keys setted on my keyboard /mouse /12 quick slots lol
Least it's NOT as bad as losing a rank for failing, and/or booming as you press [craft]...
At least Evie has to time dodges even tho it's one of the easier classes. Wizard/Witch kills people in .5 seconds in PvP (Where the skill floor/cap should matter) and can literally escape people.
https://clips.twitch.tv/twirow/SleepyLyrebirdKAPOW
Like don't get me wrong, every class can 100-0 in BDO. Thing is, Vindictus has "some" build variety, actual sustain damage, and you have to time evades. But in BDO if you don't build AP and play for the burst you put yourself at a disadvantage because "any other type of build" will just slow your farm. You get away by doing bad habits because literally most of your skills have iframes and super armor. And because there is so much DESYNC, iframes and super armor? The only viable build and playstyle in BDO is AP and kill the guy in 1 CC and within 10 SECONDS and this goes the same for ALL CLASSES no matter which class you pick in BDO.
In Vindictus, if I wanted to play a memorization + endurance game where I need to know which smash comes next after the first [space > right click] and the next ones, I'll play Hurk. If I want to test my reaction time to the fullest, I'll play Spear Lann. BDO has NO VARIETY in terms of COMBAT. And there is almost no counter argument to that. The Farmville Part (where the variety is "how you make money") is the only thing BDO has going for it and that got boring.
There is no sustain damage meta in PvP where people die within a reasonable amount of time at a minimum of 30 seconds and maximum 5 minutes.
And World Bosses compared to Vindictus bosses? They're braindead easy, no joke. My 100 AP 100 DP Valkyrie could probably do Kutum and never die for if I was half awake, for example and that's with absolute trash gear.
You can say that BDO is a PvP game and Vindictus is a PvE game, and are two different games, sure. But it doesn't change how "bad play" is most of the time never punished in BDO and that PvP is almost a socialist environment where even the "worst type of player" can succeed due to how BDO is a medium skill-floor low skill ceiling game. You play bad in Vindictus, bosses destroy you.
Ye, perfect, amazing, etc I know how beautiful and sparkling Vindi bosses are, I played there five years, meanwhile you are stuck doing the same dungeon every day and when you understand the mechanics of the boss is only boring dailie rootine, open dungeon , kill, open another dungeon, kill..if you die you get revived and start over doing the same skill rotation, dodge etc
You can decorated it with bows, super combat system (i doubt is that good in comparison) but it is always lacking something..
btw i like bdo, what can i do? most of the things you said are BS like the one we don't have to dodge o.o , 1 cc, that probably an ultimate skill which u can't spam, but fine, if u can't press dodge or block in time your problem, idk what u talking about for the rest. I like being op, that op wiz is were i'm aiming, killing a bunch of player like that is a true aspiration
Anyway back to the topic, vindi need a system where you can farm back the dura and items does not get destroyed upon fail so RNG does not matter that much..thing they will never do, matter closed.
It's a crappy game with an even crappier battle system. Its only saving grace is that as a life skilling game (think Runescape) it can be somewhat entertaining to set farming or whatever and then alt-tab out and play another game. Requiring very little actual time input for gains in that regard.
The PvP is literally nothing but cc/100-0 where it's a skill point and equipment check. There is no player skill involved at all. You could probably write a 2 key press macro to PvP for you in BDO.
The PvE is even worse. As stated, world bosses are just like all the other MMORPGs. Sit there and press 123451234512345. It's a gear check. If your gear is good enough to survive and win, you win. If it's not, you die. Simple as that. Meanwhile, in Vindictus, you can solo Regina with 19k attack on an Arisha if you're good. Or you can do it with 28k attack if you're good also. But if you're bad, no amount of attack is going to let you win (remember the time Zoltar tried to fight Muir with practically unlimited goddess graces but then he gave up instead because he couldn't do it, go check it out, should probably still be on twitch somewhere).
If you like BDO and you play it then good on you. But there's no denying that the game is dead. It's Vindictus level dead, and it's much newer than Vindictus is.
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For Black Desert to have succeeded it needed to have faster and much more sublime battle system, much in line with how Vindictus is. Intersperse it with more skills or skill combos if you want.
Make PvP combat more like an actual fighting game so you can utilize those combos while maintaining the increased speed of combat.
Literally take the pages of boss combat out of Vindictus' playbook. Speed the bosses up a bit and vary their attack patterns and hazards more to match the faster paced combat.
Then incorporate Warframe style gear progression.
Coupled with its graphics and openworld content and lifeskilling? That would've made BDO the ultimate MMORPG and I'd pay 50 bucks a month just to play it as well as more through a cash shop for aesthetics with regard to outfitters and convenience items.
lvl of BS has reach insane lvls today, I play every day and this is the scenario I witness on every world bosses / event over 36 channels on evening, if you call this "dead" , p,s there are 3800 ppls conneted right now on bdo forum (these are just the number of people logged on forum,) go check.
on an estination how many ppls vindi got? probably less than just the amount of ppls logged on bdo forum at prime time, cmn
I failed my lv 80 weapon from +4 to +5 4 times in a row (bought stones and tried again) and from +3 to +4 at least 3 times. It should be 75% chance. I know how pseudo-randomness works but the generator must be very lame because it doesn't generate a number between 0 and 75 in 5 minutes. Or even if it was between 0 and 750 the real world chance that it generates 75% would be pretty much the same.
As for enchants i haven't tried scrolls above RA since i came back in December. But even the scroll drops are heavily RNG so the overall chance that you can put a scroll on a weapon is quite low. It's not very casual-friendly. +cry
But at least i succeed more times with skill awakening on 25%'s.