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Also you're kind of missing the point I tried to make by it being hard, because "quality" can differ from person to person. Here's an example. Let's say you actually had an idea of exactly what you thought was the best grunt for each situation and told Nexon. That is your idea of "best". However, someone else also told Nexon their idea of what they thought was the best grunt for each situation and told Nexon. That is their idea of "best". So, who does Nexon listen to? What makes your "best" better than the other persons "best"? So does the other person just suck and are they just dumb because they don't think like you? Saying that their ideas suck is kind of disrespectful and close minded don't you think? That's the kind of stuff that would bug me and the kind of thing I'm thinking right now. If that's what's not happening then I'll just say I was wrong and I'm sorry. But this is the kind of thing I'm seeing by them hating on what the Voice team has done right away. I'd rather people give it some time, and actually give it a try.
If this doesn't convey what I'm trying to say then I'll just admit defeat because I have no idea how to be clearer
Well, good job reading the other things and responding. But I was kind of intending and hoping that you would read this one. Since I thought it best expressed what I was going for. Because to expand on the example, let's say that Nexon picked your voices. You're proud of it, and you worked hard to make it work, even picking up your characters weapon and practicing how you'd react to swinging the weapon etc to make it realistic as possible. Now let's say everyone poo poo'd it in the way the people that don't like it are doing. This is where the details on how it's done matters, and what bugs me. To me, it seems like people are crapping on it in such a negative jerk type of way with vague reasons on why they don't like it. Criticism and negativity would be tough to take in especially after working so hard on it. But let's say you have nerves of steel and it doesn't phase you, and you do understand that some people will like it and some people won't. However, the criticism is so vague that you don't really know how to "make it better". After all to you, it's the best thing ever, you made it as realistic as possible, going as so far as to swing a real weapon and get hit with it etc. So even if your feelings and pride aren't hurt, then you still can't learn how to "make it better", because all you're getting is negativity that you can't use. And chances are most people may have their feelings and pride hurt. Especially since people are crapping on it from day 1 minute 1 which I don't think would be a good try at it. So what bugs me isn't criticism, it's how we as the Vindi community and how other video game communities go about it. If I was a VA I would definitely appreciate people giving my effort a try, or at least getting feedback that I could actually use, preferably in a respectable manner. Because we are all still human and emotions still affect us, no matter how logical or strong we are. And to me the "criticism" seems like it is just negativity and hard to use if at all. Now if I'm not looking at the right criticisms then that's that, but from what I've seen, this is how I see it and what bugs me. We should be more welcoming and reasonable than that Having the option to change voices are fine and great. But at the very least I'll say, I have concerns on how things are approached not just here, but a lot of places and it definitely bugs me.
What cloakshire wrote is something I'd prefer and doesn't bug me. To me, there's a big difference between that and the other things that bug me.
I was about to break down the above post for a better detailed response, but I think Cloakshrine did a better job there. To be honest , I never intended to get into a long conversation anyways. Lets just agree with what Cloakshrine's listed and be done with that. I will just say there was miscommunication on my end and apologize for that.
I think the direction of the thread should focus on going in a direction that suits all parties to improve the quality of the game. That's more constructive.
https://www.bilibili.com/video/av58017606?p=8 i want to we have the kr voice in the future. the eng voice actors(female) make me so uncomfortable. eria and airsha like a man, miri goes crazy, lynn sounds like a native american old woman....T.T
There's a lot of irrelevant logic and facts and "my opinion is a right" nonsense being thrown around, and I don't think I really want to address any of it.
All I can really say is that if Devcat/Nexon don't understand why forcibly changing the aesthetics of characters in a game heavily monetized by aesthetics is an issue, then... well, who am I kidding? No feedback here even ever gets sent to people who actually need to see it, right?
https://www.bilibili.com/video/av58017606?p=8 i want to we have the kr voice in the future. the eng voice actors(female) make me so uncomfortable. eria and airsha like a man, miri goes crazy, lynn sounds like a native american old woman....T.T
Iol
All it really takes is a optional switch . A rich company like Nexon should have this XD
The assignation of the voices to each actor (i can speak at least for female chars) was totally wrong imo (excluded Belle).
Personally i think also Miri voice is good (only voice lines) but the battle clips need to be reworked. The other females are just a nope.
You can't just give some low and aged pitch tone voice to some young girls like arisha and eira (just to mention a couple).
Also the attitude given to some char is out of their char personality.
Why Eira must be perma grumpy af out of the bat, or lynn sound always irritated when she alwasy been a playful character.
These side aspects have been added without a specific reason cause they aren't part of the characters background.
I don't think anyone wanted really to say the voice actors sux as actor/actress themselves, they probably fits for other roles, but the choice of the ppl and their voice was unfitting for 'these' characters. You need a special ear sensibility, experience, and on top of that knowledge about this game in order to take such decisions.
In fact the very first impression i had when i heard them for the first time was: "whoever choosen the voices have no clue of what this game is and probably they have been given just a script with some vague guidelines on what to do and left all the rest to their own choice."
@Kurs
1. The " we should show some respect and appreciation cause they did some hard work" is just silly. But Sixth already explained you why.
It doesn't work like that when you're selling a product and there're a lot of ppl here that are customers.
2. As someone said already is not anymore something subjective when most of the ppl don't like it, a very few like, and a few others doesn't really care.
And not necessarely ppl are bound to the original sounds just cause they have been used since the first version.
I played KR/NA/EU/TW and i could still tell that some (old) na/eu voices were better than kr and viceversa.
But after this patch if we now compare kr to na, the old NA voices or korean voices are way better.
Despite probably 90% of the ppl don't understand a word about korean, you can clearly tell they're more fitting and ppl would prefer them over NA voices.
(Taiwan old voices were just horrible. Ten times worse than what we got).
However since i don't truly believe they'll record them again, i expect them at least to give us a toggle to switch between NA(new/old) and KR for the sake of everyone, and cause is a cheap solution (for them).
In the game files atm are still present the new voices, the old one, and also the korean version.
Well, idk what to tell you, if you think there are a lot of irrevilent stuff but don't want to address it. Well there's nothing I can do about that, if people don't want to listen to what others say and just think the other person is stupid then... well that seems like a dumb way to debate doesn't it?
1. The " we should show some respect and appreciation cause they did some hard work" is just silly. But Sixth already explained you why.
It doesn't work like that when you're selling a product and there're a lot of ppl here that are customers.
It does work, because while Nexon is selling something and the customers are important, I'm looking at the fact that Nexon is made up of individual employees who are internal and in this case external employees working for another company. So Sixth response was that it wasn't tested enough and there are problems like overlapping or something. Okay, that's possibly a valid issue assuming that was a mistake and not a creative decision. However, I believe that most of the complaining comes from the tones or choices in which sound bite goes with which action, somewhat like KoeniginYu's complaint. So let me ask you, what does a "native american old woman" sound like? How should Eira and Arisha sound like? What is Lynns personality, and what's an appropriate voice for that personality? Chances are every single person will have a different answer to each of those questions if they even have an answer at all.
Sixths response with the overlapping stuff is a okay response, however I believe the employees deserve some respect because chances are they did do their testing, they did take pride in their work, and they did try and I think that's worth respect. Because I'm guessing that the employees were working off of what the Vindi creators gave them, each character has a set personality and data, and chances are the creators have a direction they want to take these characters, so these employees did their best, to pick the best voices based on the character personalities (Eira and Arisha may not be as young as you assume and given their backstory, chances are there's a reason why Eira is grumpy, not everyone is going to be a happy Asian, and everyone responds to things differently), and the given direction, and there were a wider range of talent other than higher pitched Asian. The creators/storytellers may even had involvement in picking the voices, and thought these talents best fit the English language and are more what they were going for.
Let's say they did bring in some players to "test" the voices, chances are everyone would have different opinions, and their opinions would be based on basic tropes and individual experiences rather than what the creators intended. And I'll be honest I'd rather see what the creators have in mind in terms of character development than some basic trope that customers expect and see. I mean isn't that one of the great things about story telling? Being put on a ride and expanding our experiences towards more than what we expect? I bet mistakes were made, however the quality and effort are there, and I think that is worth respect. Sure, get your voice option. But I think the effort is worth the respect, and for me I like character development and I'm sure there are others like me. So to me it's something nice and new and different coming along with new bosses.
2. As someone said already is not anymore something subjective when most of the ppl don't like it, a very few like, and a few others doesn't really care.
And not necessarely ppl are bound to the original sounds just cause they have been used since the first version.
I played KR/NA/EU/TW and i could still tell that some (old) na/eu voices were better than kr and viceversa.
But after this patch if we now compare kr to na, the old NA voices or korean voices are way better.
Despite probably 90% of the ppl don't understand a word about korean, you can clearly tell they're more fitting and ppl would prefer them over NA voices.
(Taiwan old voices were just horrible. Ten times worse than what we got).
My question is how do you know "most people don't like it" What makes you sure they're not just the vocal few? How many people did you ask? How many people actually play and how do you know that's the number? Is it possible that some people just don't care to voice their opinion? Are you just asking people you know? And is it possible that people who stick together tend to get the same information and no other opinions which affects their responses to things which means the people you ask will give you similar responses while there are many other people who have different views? And like I said in the above response. What is "better?" Does it have to be high pitch Asian? Which is more important in character creation? What the storyteller intended the character to be like, sound like etc. Or what the viewer expected the character to be and when it's not does the storyteller have to rewrite the story? And even if they did which viewer do they listen to? Does the listener even know what they want? I thought Lynns combat voice was pretty similar to the original but KoeniginYu thinks she now sounds like an "old native american woman" What the heck does a "old native american woman" sound like. The Lynn voice actor looks Asian to me, she just doesn't use the high pitch from Japan Anime character voice sooooooooo.... yeah
Also I'm sure everyones speakers are different so they may hear different things.
... if people don't want to listen to what others say and just think the other person is stupid then...
Sure, act like you are not part of that group you just described.
To be honest, you are the only one debating something here. The others just share their opinions, while YOU try hard to invalidate theirs with your assumptions and idealistic views on employment (which doesn't even hold any ground in the real world).
You honestly think they tested these voices? When I play lann, I can't hear anything else but 2 types of LOUD yelling. No variety whatsoever, just constant yelling, no mater what I do, it's yelling after yelling after yelling. And they are long, very long. You think it's fun to play like this? Hearing constant, loud yelling for hours while I do my raids? A creative decision? Really? Having to mute the game to be able to play without headache sure is fun. +best
Ohh, and yes, eira is so grumpy that she smiles in almost every single animation she does. Grumpy all the way!
For the people saying "you should be happy they actually did something for a change."
**** you.
No seriously, **** you.
The don't get to destroy my character's persona and me have to be happy about it. Piss, the hell, off.
This isnt a freaking moba, where the character is some premade freaking hero garbage. This isnt Overwatch. I didnt make Tracer, but I did make my Fiona.
We got a character creator, that I got to make my character look how I WANTED her to look. I got to chose what MY chracter did.
And you have the BALLS to say "you should be happy they updated things" Piss. off.
I was alread mad I got forced to wear skin oil, I was already upset they changed the traditional Gnoll models to overly buff ugly meatheads when there was absolutely no reason too, and now they screw with my personal character YET AGAIN, who has been in the game for longer than most of you have even been AWARE of this game, and you have the Balls to say "you should be happy they updated things"
Bite me.
Change it back, Nexon.
Give me my characters voice back.
... if people don't want to listen to what others say and just think the other person is stupid then...
Sure, act like you are not part of that group you just described.
To be honest, you are the only one debating something here. The others just share their opinions, while YOU try hard to invalidate theirs with your assumptions and idealistic views on employment (which doesn't even hold any ground in the real world).
You honestly think they tested these voices? When I play lann, I can't hear anything else but 2 types of LOUD yelling. No variety whatsoever, just constant yelling, no mater what I do, it's yelling after yelling after yelling. And they are long, very long. You think it's fun to play like this? Hearing constant, loud yelling for hours while I do my raids? A creative decision? Really? Having to mute the game to be able to play without headache sure is fun. +best
Ohh, and yes, eira is so grumpy that she smiles in almost every single animation she does. Grumpy all the way!
I'm not part of the group I described, because I actually do try to listen and understand the other sides point of view. Just because I'm not immediately on your side after you state your case doesn't mean that I'm not trying to listen and understand the other sides point of view. Because the fact is while the other side has put thought into their argument, so have I. And there are many reasons why it can be hard to get a point across, and in the end the debate may just end up being a difference of priorities. You on the other hand... idk what you're doing, but based on what you just accused me of, I'm a bit wary of how you approach things. I never assumed the other person is stupid, and I do my best to show respect and try to understand everything,
I don't know how many sound bits Lanns original Korean yelling has, and how many yelling sounds the Korean voice has and if the voice team tried to replace the Korean voices 1 to 1 with English voices, or if they slacked off and removed some, like the original Evie voice. So, if you think it's bad then okay, but that doesn't mean they necessarily didn't do testing. Like I said, mistakes can be made and different people have different ideas of "better", or there could have been time constraints or it could've been something like they meant to fix it however put it on hold due to scheduling, and eventually forgot to address it and made due with what they had. I heard a few voice actors thinking "oh no I should've done it this way instead" after the fact, and this may end up being like that. But personally I'm fine with Evies voice and Lynns voice for sure. And as far as Eira being grumpy and smiling at almost every single animation she does. Being grumpy about most things, doesn't mean you're totally all about being grumpy and can't enjoy anything. Perhaps the personality the voice team was trying to create is a tired woman, who traveled across the world seeing the worst it had to offer, barely having any prolonged social interaction while looking for her sister. Hence the "grumpiness" in her voice, however this doesn't mean she has to be constantly devoid of pleasure and expression, such as the pleasure of putting a bullet in random monsters she has fun overpowering. And like in lots of Animes, emotionless characters do have things that bring out a smile in their faces, usually by the main character.
In the end I'm going to say that the voice team and VA's deserves some respect, at the very least because they didn't take the easy road and just subtitle the Korean voices. And by hiring the VA's they gave them another job which means more money for the VA's, and more potential exposure. And in the end I'm not going to say that attempting to go a little further than necessary isn't worth some respect.
@FranBunnyFFXII
In the beginning all we had were a few sentences to give us hints on character personality, and only a year or two did we have a backstory, the backstory given in the prologue is a compacted version of the full story given in the Korean site and even then, how they talk, how they sound, was left mostly to our imagination. But it seems like you preferred that. But I guess this is where differences in priorities and views or wants are. Some people like a good story, some people like things left to their individual imagination, with you being in the latter. I like a good story with concrete character development, while it seems to me you rather have a vague or even clean slate character which you can create their own personality, or impose your personality on them, which I think it's fine. It's just a matter of Nexon picking to go the concrete personality route, which would be for people like me instead of you for better or worse.
As for the skin oil stuff... I'm not sure what you're talking about because I don't remember ever having my characters shininess (which I'm assuming you're talking about that when you say "skin oil") changing, but I left my character as its default from day 1 after open beta, so maybe what you're saying effected only people who didn't leave their character as its default, or the change happened before I got a good enough computer to see the shininess, but then again I think I changed computers before the Appearance Alteration Coupons arrived. If that's the case then I'd say bad Nexon.
You're fulla crap Kurz. "Mostly to our imagination" "I like Piss off. How dare you, you pretentious self important prick.
How god dammned DARE you **** talk to me like I dont know anything about lore.
I am **** lore writer and creator you snot. That's my current work. I CREATE Characters based on stories.
I am literally right now in the middle of writing the first of 2 novels in which are the origin stories of the lore universe that I am the lead creator of.
Half the damn characters I play in ANY GAME are due to their lore.
What a blazingly stupid and ignorant thing to say to someone. Especially someone who is extremely interested in lore.
They dont deserve jack **** and you don't know what the skin oil thing is because you never **** cared about it like it I did.
There were no body options when the game started, they added all of it LATER. Maybe you don't remember this beacuse you didnt play OBT, or CBT like I did.
Maybe you don't have a character that's left over from the first wave of OBT like my character is from.
Maybe you didnt notice it, but I sure as hell did.
And guess what? Nexon acknowledged it too, because when I asked for a alteration voucher to fix it, they were immediately understanding and a GM logged in and gave me a free vouncher because they knew my character was altered without my consent.
Blindly defending nexon over this crap is ridiculous. Over 90% of the community is obviously pissed off about this.
You're a shill, and a pretentious self important jerk.
How incredibly disrespectful you are.
Seriously, **** you.
Why am I a self important prick? and wasn't the main characters left mostly to our imagination in the beginning? How am I wrong about that? The only things I saw describing our characters were things like "From her demeanor Evie was probably from a noble from the East but when asked about her history she just smiles and changes the subject". That to me leaves a lot to the imagination. I think you're misunderstanding what I said because what you just stated is exactly what I meant. You like to create your own stories and bring them to your character. I totally love lore in games and stories, I love going into detail about them. And I did care about the oil, when I finally got a computer with a good enough graphics card I was all "OMG WE'RE SO SHINY IT'S SO COOL". And my character is from the first day after closed beta which was when Evie was first released. Liking something that you don't like doesn't and shouldn't make me a self important jerk. It just means I like something different and have different views, and I don't think that's wrong. What makes my views less important than yours? Why am I a self important prick just because I like something that you don't like? From what i'm seeing you're being disrespectful by calling me names, and making assumptions. I'm asking questions, and trying to understand other points of views but you're just spewing out curse words. Calm down. actually read what I say carefully or at least don't jump to the conclusion that just because I have a different view that I'm for or against certain things or am saying certain things. If something sounds stupid it's probably is stupid and chances are that's not what the other person intends.. Or at the very least it's worth asking if that's what they intend before telling them **** you.
@Kurs
I don't care if you are left side or right side, or whatever.
Your arguments about respect this and that are simply hilarious and misplaced, purely because you read something that isn't there.
Next time you see a building collapse due to bad design please go there and do some hand claps for those who designed it, because "their effort deserves respect".
See what I did there?
And yes, you don't know. But you keep talking about it like you do. And you don't see the many wrongs in that?
If they tested these voices and thought that a yelling that is 4x longer than my animation is fine, than they clearly did something very wrong.
I don't spout these out from my bubbles floating around, I am in the game development business myself. You assuming that everything went okay with these voices at the office is just... Lets just say that you look at things differently when you know what's going on behind the curtains, very differently.
Full of contradictions, that's what I see in your posts, but I won't make a wall of text about it, it's pointless.
You can try to explain anything with excuses if it makes you feel better, it's your choice. I prefer facts over excuses and assumptions any time of the day.
@Sixth
what you're saying about me I could say the same thing about you.
You're saying I'm wrong, but not really telling me in what ways I am, or are giving me something very vague. I'd rather you point out which parts of what I am saying is wrong. Otherwise I can't understand how I'm wrong if I am in fact wrong, and if I'm not wrong then I can't understand what parts you're not understanding which I'm trying to communicate.
Your building comparison is something totally different, a bad building architecture is obviously bad if the structure collapses and it's something that's easier to avoid because of physics and engineering sciences. Voice acting is a little different, certain bad voice acting can be easily pointed out, other times, not so much because it's a matter of preference. After all what is Lynn supposed to sound like.
And your focus on Lanns voice being longer than the animation might be okay, however what about the other voices and my issue isn't about things like that. Those issues would be valid to me at face value, however what I think is wrong is people judging and hating right away, saying things like "Lynn sounds like an old native american woman" "that's not how Eira is supposed to sound, she's supposed to be sweet and happy that's how I imagined her, damn you Nexon for making Eira not how I imagined". The second quote is obviously not exactly what someone said word for word but I hope you get the idea.
If you're in the video game business then tell me, does the video game business have timelines, crunchtimes etc? Do people make mistakes? Can there be creative differences where one person thinks one thing is great, and another person on the team thinks it's absolutely horrible? So let's say that you're right, and there's absolutely no doubt that Lanns voice is 4 times longer than it should be. What about everything else? Does that one mistake make all the other voices horrible or make it so that the voice teams effort and everything else they did right not respectable? Because, again let's say that you're right and Lanns voice is 4 times longer than it should be, okay at face value I would take that as a valid issue, but my issue is with the other complaints, like the tone, the choice in voices and personality. and AGAIN I'll ask, whose version of what Eira should be like, talk like, and sound like, is more important when telling a story? The storytellers, or the audiences which each individual audience member can have conflicting ideas of "what should be". So just because it sounds different from what you immediately think "what should be" (which usually seems to be what was originally heard, whether it's the original NA voices or the original Korean voices), does that constitute a lack of effort, or that they should not be respected? So far I've been only told one or two issues which I'm fine with saying they're valid issues. However, what about everything else? You're thinking I'm dumb just because I'm not with you right away 100 percent. And this is why I think you don't seem to be addressing what I'm trying to say.
I don't think what I'm saying is contradicting itself, just like I'm sure you don't think what you say contradicts itself, I think what I'm saying is fully reasonable, smart, and logical and fine, just like I'm sure you think the same of what you're saying. That's how it usually is in debates, both sides absolutely believe in what they say, and both sides may be right, or one side may be wrong but it'll take some time to get the wrong side to see that because the other side has to pinpoint what the wrong side is seeing and what exactly they are trying to communicate and what are they missing. Now what part of that seems dumb? So if you believe that I'm "Full of contradictions" then I challenge you to point out where and I challenge you to try to understand my point, because so far it still seems that you don't. I prefer facts over excuses too. And that's what I tend to use too. I mean come on, do you really think you're the smartest person in the whole world or room and that everyone else who doesn't seem to agree with you 100 percent right away is dumb? That seems dumb and arrogant to me. While you think you're smart, I think I'm smart too, while you think I'm dumb, usually the other side thinks you're dumb too. However, I won't think you're dumb because doing that would be dumb, because then I won't ask questions, I won't try to understand you and then that's not a debate, that's not trying to expand my views outside of my box, and that's not trying to learn which I think is dumb.
>Kurz posts another round of word vomit full of assumptions shilling and responses not based on what people are saying.
Why do you even partisipate if you're just going to stamp around a pigeon shitting on the chess board?
and what are you doing? I dare you to point which parts are unreasonable and full of assumptions, shilling and responses not based on what people are saying. Like I said if you see something I don't see then say it.
Comments
Well, good job reading the other things and responding. But I was kind of intending and hoping that you would read this one. Since I thought it best expressed what I was going for. Because to expand on the example, let's say that Nexon picked your voices. You're proud of it, and you worked hard to make it work, even picking up your characters weapon and practicing how you'd react to swinging the weapon etc to make it realistic as possible. Now let's say everyone poo poo'd it in the way the people that don't like it are doing. This is where the details on how it's done matters, and what bugs me. To me, it seems like people are crapping on it in such a negative jerk type of way with vague reasons on why they don't like it. Criticism and negativity would be tough to take in especially after working so hard on it. But let's say you have nerves of steel and it doesn't phase you, and you do understand that some people will like it and some people won't. However, the criticism is so vague that you don't really know how to "make it better". After all to you, it's the best thing ever, you made it as realistic as possible, going as so far as to swing a real weapon and get hit with it etc. So even if your feelings and pride aren't hurt, then you still can't learn how to "make it better", because all you're getting is negativity that you can't use. And chances are most people may have their feelings and pride hurt. Especially since people are crapping on it from day 1 minute 1 which I don't think would be a good try at it. So what bugs me isn't criticism, it's how we as the Vindi community and how other video game communities go about it. If I was a VA I would definitely appreciate people giving my effort a try, or at least getting feedback that I could actually use, preferably in a respectable manner. Because we are all still human and emotions still affect us, no matter how logical or strong we are. And to me the "criticism" seems like it is just negativity and hard to use if at all. Now if I'm not looking at the right criticisms then that's that, but from what I've seen, this is how I see it and what bugs me. We should be more welcoming and reasonable than that Having the option to change voices are fine and great. But at the very least I'll say, I have concerns on how things are approached not just here, but a lot of places and it definitely bugs me.
I was about to break down the above post for a better detailed response, but I think Cloakshrine did a better job there. To be honest , I never intended to get into a long conversation anyways. Lets just agree with what Cloakshrine's listed and be done with that. I will just say there was miscommunication on my end and apologize for that.
I think the direction of the thread should focus on going in a direction that suits all parties to improve the quality of the game. That's more constructive.
This is absolutely inappropriate.
All I can really say is that if Devcat/Nexon don't understand why forcibly changing the aesthetics of characters in a game heavily monetized by aesthetics is an issue, then... well, who am I kidding? No feedback here even ever gets sent to people who actually need to see it, right?
Iol
All it really takes is a optional switch . A rich company like Nexon should have this XD
Personally i think also Miri voice is good (only voice lines) but the battle clips need to be reworked. The other females are just a nope.
You can't just give some low and aged pitch tone voice to some young girls like arisha and eira (just to mention a couple).
Also the attitude given to some char is out of their char personality.
Why Eira must be perma grumpy af out of the bat, or lynn sound always irritated when she alwasy been a playful character.
These side aspects have been added without a specific reason cause they aren't part of the characters background.
I don't think anyone wanted really to say the voice actors sux as actor/actress themselves, they probably fits for other roles, but the choice of the ppl and their voice was unfitting for 'these' characters. You need a special ear sensibility, experience, and on top of that knowledge about this game in order to take such decisions.
In fact the very first impression i had when i heard them for the first time was: "whoever choosen the voices have no clue of what this game is and probably they have been given just a script with some vague guidelines on what to do and left all the rest to their own choice."
@Kurs
1. The " we should show some respect and appreciation cause they did some hard work" is just silly. But Sixth already explained you why.
It doesn't work like that when you're selling a product and there're a lot of ppl here that are customers.
2. As someone said already is not anymore something subjective when most of the ppl don't like it, a very few like, and a few others doesn't really care.
And not necessarely ppl are bound to the original sounds just cause they have been used since the first version.
I played KR/NA/EU/TW and i could still tell that some (old) na/eu voices were better than kr and viceversa.
But after this patch if we now compare kr to na, the old NA voices or korean voices are way better.
Despite probably 90% of the ppl don't understand a word about korean, you can clearly tell they're more fitting and ppl would prefer them over NA voices.
(Taiwan old voices were just horrible. Ten times worse than what we got).
However since i don't truly believe they'll record them again, i expect them at least to give us a toggle to switch between NA(new/old) and KR for the sake of everyone, and cause is a cheap solution (for them).
In the game files atm are still present the new voices, the old one, and also the korean version.
Well, idk what to tell you, if you think there are a lot of irrevilent stuff but don't want to address it. Well there's nothing I can do about that, if people don't want to listen to what others say and just think the other person is stupid then... well that seems like a dumb way to debate doesn't it?
@DancingStar
It does work, because while Nexon is selling something and the customers are important, I'm looking at the fact that Nexon is made up of individual employees who are internal and in this case external employees working for another company. So Sixth response was that it wasn't tested enough and there are problems like overlapping or something. Okay, that's possibly a valid issue assuming that was a mistake and not a creative decision. However, I believe that most of the complaining comes from the tones or choices in which sound bite goes with which action, somewhat like KoeniginYu's complaint. So let me ask you, what does a "native american old woman" sound like? How should Eira and Arisha sound like? What is Lynns personality, and what's an appropriate voice for that personality? Chances are every single person will have a different answer to each of those questions if they even have an answer at all.
Sixths response with the overlapping stuff is a okay response, however I believe the employees deserve some respect because chances are they did do their testing, they did take pride in their work, and they did try and I think that's worth respect. Because I'm guessing that the employees were working off of what the Vindi creators gave them, each character has a set personality and data, and chances are the creators have a direction they want to take these characters, so these employees did their best, to pick the best voices based on the character personalities (Eira and Arisha may not be as young as you assume and given their backstory, chances are there's a reason why Eira is grumpy, not everyone is going to be a happy Asian, and everyone responds to things differently), and the given direction, and there were a wider range of talent other than higher pitched Asian. The creators/storytellers may even had involvement in picking the voices, and thought these talents best fit the English language and are more what they were going for.
Let's say they did bring in some players to "test" the voices, chances are everyone would have different opinions, and their opinions would be based on basic tropes and individual experiences rather than what the creators intended. And I'll be honest I'd rather see what the creators have in mind in terms of character development than some basic trope that customers expect and see. I mean isn't that one of the great things about story telling? Being put on a ride and expanding our experiences towards more than what we expect? I bet mistakes were made, however the quality and effort are there, and I think that is worth respect. Sure, get your voice option. But I think the effort is worth the respect, and for me I like character development and I'm sure there are others like me. So to me it's something nice and new and different coming along with new bosses.
My question is how do you know "most people don't like it" What makes you sure they're not just the vocal few? How many people did you ask? How many people actually play and how do you know that's the number? Is it possible that some people just don't care to voice their opinion? Are you just asking people you know? And is it possible that people who stick together tend to get the same information and no other opinions which affects their responses to things which means the people you ask will give you similar responses while there are many other people who have different views? And like I said in the above response. What is "better?" Does it have to be high pitch Asian? Which is more important in character creation? What the storyteller intended the character to be like, sound like etc. Or what the viewer expected the character to be and when it's not does the storyteller have to rewrite the story? And even if they did which viewer do they listen to? Does the listener even know what they want? I thought Lynns combat voice was pretty similar to the original but KoeniginYu thinks she now sounds like an "old native american woman" What the heck does a "old native american woman" sound like. The Lynn voice actor looks Asian to me, she just doesn't use the high pitch from Japan Anime character voice sooooooooo.... yeah
Also I'm sure everyones speakers are different so they may hear different things.
To be honest, you are the only one debating something here. The others just share their opinions, while YOU try hard to invalidate theirs with your assumptions and idealistic views on employment (which doesn't even hold any ground in the real world).
You honestly think they tested these voices? When I play lann, I can't hear anything else but 2 types of LOUD yelling. No variety whatsoever, just constant yelling, no mater what I do, it's yelling after yelling after yelling. And they are long, very long. You think it's fun to play like this? Hearing constant, loud yelling for hours while I do my raids? A creative decision? Really? Having to mute the game to be able to play without headache sure is fun. +best
Ohh, and yes, eira is so grumpy that she smiles in almost every single animation she does. Grumpy all the way!
**** you.
No seriously, **** you.
The don't get to destroy my character's persona and me have to be happy about it. Piss, the hell, off.
This isnt a freaking moba, where the character is some premade freaking hero garbage. This isnt Overwatch. I didnt make Tracer, but I did make my Fiona.
We got a character creator, that I got to make my character look how I WANTED her to look. I got to chose what MY chracter did.
And you have the BALLS to say "you should be happy they updated things" Piss. off.
I was alread mad I got forced to wear skin oil, I was already upset they changed the traditional Gnoll models to overly buff ugly meatheads when there was absolutely no reason too, and now they screw with my personal character YET AGAIN, who has been in the game for longer than most of you have even been AWARE of this game, and you have the Balls to say "you should be happy they updated things"
Bite me.
Change it back, Nexon.
Give me my characters voice back.
I'm not part of the group I described, because I actually do try to listen and understand the other sides point of view. Just because I'm not immediately on your side after you state your case doesn't mean that I'm not trying to listen and understand the other sides point of view. Because the fact is while the other side has put thought into their argument, so have I. And there are many reasons why it can be hard to get a point across, and in the end the debate may just end up being a difference of priorities. You on the other hand... idk what you're doing, but based on what you just accused me of, I'm a bit wary of how you approach things. I never assumed the other person is stupid, and I do my best to show respect and try to understand everything,
I don't know how many sound bits Lanns original Korean yelling has, and how many yelling sounds the Korean voice has and if the voice team tried to replace the Korean voices 1 to 1 with English voices, or if they slacked off and removed some, like the original Evie voice. So, if you think it's bad then okay, but that doesn't mean they necessarily didn't do testing. Like I said, mistakes can be made and different people have different ideas of "better", or there could have been time constraints or it could've been something like they meant to fix it however put it on hold due to scheduling, and eventually forgot to address it and made due with what they had. I heard a few voice actors thinking "oh no I should've done it this way instead" after the fact, and this may end up being like that. But personally I'm fine with Evies voice and Lynns voice for sure. And as far as Eira being grumpy and smiling at almost every single animation she does. Being grumpy about most things, doesn't mean you're totally all about being grumpy and can't enjoy anything. Perhaps the personality the voice team was trying to create is a tired woman, who traveled across the world seeing the worst it had to offer, barely having any prolonged social interaction while looking for her sister. Hence the "grumpiness" in her voice, however this doesn't mean she has to be constantly devoid of pleasure and expression, such as the pleasure of putting a bullet in random monsters she has fun overpowering. And like in lots of Animes, emotionless characters do have things that bring out a smile in their faces, usually by the main character.
In the end I'm going to say that the voice team and VA's deserves some respect, at the very least because they didn't take the easy road and just subtitle the Korean voices. And by hiring the VA's they gave them another job which means more money for the VA's, and more potential exposure. And in the end I'm not going to say that attempting to go a little further than necessary isn't worth some respect.
@FranBunnyFFXII
In the beginning all we had were a few sentences to give us hints on character personality, and only a year or two did we have a backstory, the backstory given in the prologue is a compacted version of the full story given in the Korean site and even then, how they talk, how they sound, was left mostly to our imagination. But it seems like you preferred that. But I guess this is where differences in priorities and views or wants are. Some people like a good story, some people like things left to their individual imagination, with you being in the latter. I like a good story with concrete character development, while it seems to me you rather have a vague or even clean slate character which you can create their own personality, or impose your personality on them, which I think it's fine. It's just a matter of Nexon picking to go the concrete personality route, which would be for people like me instead of you for better or worse.
As for the skin oil stuff... I'm not sure what you're talking about because I don't remember ever having my characters shininess (which I'm assuming you're talking about that when you say "skin oil") changing, but I left my character as its default from day 1 after open beta, so maybe what you're saying effected only people who didn't leave their character as its default, or the change happened before I got a good enough computer to see the shininess, but then again I think I changed computers before the Appearance Alteration Coupons arrived. If that's the case then I'd say bad Nexon.
How god dammned DARE you **** talk to me like I dont know anything about lore.
I am **** lore writer and creator you snot. That's my current work. I CREATE Characters based on stories.
I am literally right now in the middle of writing the first of 2 novels in which are the origin stories of the lore universe that I am the lead creator of.
Half the damn characters I play in ANY GAME are due to their lore.
What a blazingly stupid and ignorant thing to say to someone. Especially someone who is extremely interested in lore.
They dont deserve jack **** and you don't know what the skin oil thing is because you never **** cared about it like it I did.
There were no body options when the game started, they added all of it LATER. Maybe you don't remember this beacuse you didnt play OBT, or CBT like I did.
Maybe you don't have a character that's left over from the first wave of OBT like my character is from.
Maybe you didnt notice it, but I sure as hell did.
And guess what? Nexon acknowledged it too, because when I asked for a alteration voucher to fix it, they were immediately understanding and a GM logged in and gave me a free vouncher because they knew my character was altered without my consent.
Blindly defending nexon over this crap is ridiculous. Over 90% of the community is obviously pissed off about this.
You're a shill, and a pretentious self important jerk.
How incredibly disrespectful you are.
Seriously, **** you.
I don't care if you are left side or right side, or whatever.
Your arguments about respect this and that are simply hilarious and misplaced, purely because you read something that isn't there.
Next time you see a building collapse due to bad design please go there and do some hand claps for those who designed it, because "their effort deserves respect".
See what I did there?
And yes, you don't know. But you keep talking about it like you do. And you don't see the many wrongs in that?
If they tested these voices and thought that a yelling that is 4x longer than my animation is fine, than they clearly did something very wrong.
I don't spout these out from my bubbles floating around, I am in the game development business myself. You assuming that everything went okay with these voices at the office is just... Lets just say that you look at things differently when you know what's going on behind the curtains, very differently.
Full of contradictions, that's what I see in your posts, but I won't make a wall of text about it, it's pointless.
You can try to explain anything with excuses if it makes you feel better, it's your choice. I prefer facts over excuses and assumptions any time of the day.
what you're saying about me I could say the same thing about you.
You're saying I'm wrong, but not really telling me in what ways I am, or are giving me something very vague. I'd rather you point out which parts of what I am saying is wrong. Otherwise I can't understand how I'm wrong if I am in fact wrong, and if I'm not wrong then I can't understand what parts you're not understanding which I'm trying to communicate.
Your building comparison is something totally different, a bad building architecture is obviously bad if the structure collapses and it's something that's easier to avoid because of physics and engineering sciences. Voice acting is a little different, certain bad voice acting can be easily pointed out, other times, not so much because it's a matter of preference. After all what is Lynn supposed to sound like.
And your focus on Lanns voice being longer than the animation might be okay, however what about the other voices and my issue isn't about things like that. Those issues would be valid to me at face value, however what I think is wrong is people judging and hating right away, saying things like "Lynn sounds like an old native american woman" "that's not how Eira is supposed to sound, she's supposed to be sweet and happy that's how I imagined her, damn you Nexon for making Eira not how I imagined". The second quote is obviously not exactly what someone said word for word but I hope you get the idea.
If you're in the video game business then tell me, does the video game business have timelines, crunchtimes etc? Do people make mistakes? Can there be creative differences where one person thinks one thing is great, and another person on the team thinks it's absolutely horrible? So let's say that you're right, and there's absolutely no doubt that Lanns voice is 4 times longer than it should be. What about everything else? Does that one mistake make all the other voices horrible or make it so that the voice teams effort and everything else they did right not respectable? Because, again let's say that you're right and Lanns voice is 4 times longer than it should be, okay at face value I would take that as a valid issue, but my issue is with the other complaints, like the tone, the choice in voices and personality. and AGAIN I'll ask, whose version of what Eira should be like, talk like, and sound like, is more important when telling a story? The storytellers, or the audiences which each individual audience member can have conflicting ideas of "what should be". So just because it sounds different from what you immediately think "what should be" (which usually seems to be what was originally heard, whether it's the original NA voices or the original Korean voices), does that constitute a lack of effort, or that they should not be respected? So far I've been only told one or two issues which I'm fine with saying they're valid issues. However, what about everything else? You're thinking I'm dumb just because I'm not with you right away 100 percent. And this is why I think you don't seem to be addressing what I'm trying to say.
I don't think what I'm saying is contradicting itself, just like I'm sure you don't think what you say contradicts itself, I think what I'm saying is fully reasonable, smart, and logical and fine, just like I'm sure you think the same of what you're saying. That's how it usually is in debates, both sides absolutely believe in what they say, and both sides may be right, or one side may be wrong but it'll take some time to get the wrong side to see that because the other side has to pinpoint what the wrong side is seeing and what exactly they are trying to communicate and what are they missing. Now what part of that seems dumb? So if you believe that I'm "Full of contradictions" then I challenge you to point out where and I challenge you to try to understand my point, because so far it still seems that you don't. I prefer facts over excuses too. And that's what I tend to use too. I mean come on, do you really think you're the smartest person in the whole world or room and that everyone else who doesn't seem to agree with you 100 percent right away is dumb? That seems dumb and arrogant to me. While you think you're smart, I think I'm smart too, while you think I'm dumb, usually the other side thinks you're dumb too. However, I won't think you're dumb because doing that would be dumb, because then I won't ask questions, I won't try to understand you and then that's not a debate, that's not trying to expand my views outside of my box, and that's not trying to learn which I think is dumb.
Why do you even partisipate if you're just going to stamp around a pigeon shitting on the chess board?
If you won't then that's on you.