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is the game dead ?

tom50574tom50574
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edited August 15, 2017 in General Discussion
for 3 weeks or so i have been looking to buy a +13-15 xgun or bow lvl 90 - 95 and none in east market forums or in game market .

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  • SuhpremeSuhpreme
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    yep
    tom50574
  • Arrow95Arrow95
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    My Self i would say the population of vindi is about 1/3rd of what it used to be like say in 2014, and making +13 to +15 is hell of a lot harder now, only can boom once/ the rate is pretty much cut in half, +13 is 20% gg
    BraveBlade2
  • tom50574tom50574
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    edited August 14, 2017
    yes i agree i have try many times to get 12 or higher (only get 11 with runes lol ) and have over 50k AP to use, but not worth restore cant get anything back and boom once cant go higher. thank you all for input.
    cant get mats back the 2nd time i mean. RNG on what mats u get back from first boom.
    BraveBlade2
  • MelopsumMelopsum
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    edited August 14, 2017
    I',m an old player. My first character pimps the 'PWNd by GLaDoS" title for reference, and I still got my crowbar. I probably play for two to three weeks once or twice a year, maybe. Combat is fun yeah, but I always end up quitting after trying to deal with "the grind", 'the bot killed economy, and/or the pay to win NX marketplace. I assume most people are fed up and only the die hard whales and newbies are playing. Bet there's no real middle ground like there use to be from release to the end of S1. BTW the whole next part is absolutely 100% rant, feel free to ignore it. I'm just in my quitting mood again.

    I probably got 1 point a day in tailoring for the past two weeks. All from mission farming with my four characters created over the span of 7 years, because that **** is hella overpriced. Didn't even get into S3. Supposedly I should be grateful that they did away with requiring 1% chance boss drops and break offs, but no, instead it's 10 ore/cloth, 11 pigment, and probably 11 additives. Not spending 500k to a solid mil to 'maybe' get a skill point then 'maybe' resell the crafted item to recoup the cost of one or two pigments. You know, roughly the same as if I had to pay for expensive break off and rare drops anyway. Takes about 40 runs to farm the mats for a single craft at 330. If I wanted to play long haul crafting games I'd have stuck to Everquest or Mabinogi. I got Minecraft(PC) in my life, and all the mods I could ever want for my crafting itch. **** 5 minutes per craft, Vindictus crafting, **** botters charging 30k -90k for a single pigment/additive, and **** ass farming storeroom and Cohlru for mats to cap on 4 cats to get enough to craft once. Hack Bots killed the economy 5 years ago, and there's no reviving it. I wish Nexon would consider that when trying to fix crafting and drop related stuff. I got invited to a guild once, but I declined. Said I didn't have the time for that. Already spend 2 to 3 hours getting mats for 1 crafting point, and I got 4 characters. Ain't no one got time for that mess.

    If they ever swap this game from an mmo to a single player or local lan game on steam, than altered the content to fit, and the grind to be more in line with modern western taste that just ain't got time to do Korean grind, I'd probably buy it. I was wishing I could just play my Vindictus characters in Darksouls, cause the game type is just right, but I much prefer vindictus style combat. Too bad that I love Vindictus combat, but practically hate everything else. The whole reason I come back every now and then is to see if they changed the things I don't like. Sure they changed most things now, but it's still just the same thing with a different paint job on it.

    If you can't tell my 2 to 3 weeks of playing are up again as the frustration finally peeked again. This'll probably be my last post for another 6 months to a year, when I feel the urge to play again. Yeah I spent money. Cosmetics and space, bout 80 bucks worth over the long duration this game has been around. Too bad Nexon deleted my left over nexon points from the last time I played and paid real money for NX. It might be just 2 bucks, but it's 2 bucks that were robbed. Who knew Nexon points expire? I didn't. Never getting my money again.
    tom50574BraveBlade2
  • tom50574tom50574
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    i agree crafting is useless when what u craft can drop with scrolls and +uped now. all the old mats and old armor useless. no titles for armor(kinda glad i dont have to keep them all anymore) i guess crafting is usefull if u want to try to get 3* on lvl 90 -95 gear but u can get the * with 80 daily tickets so idk if anything is worth doing . thank you for insight
    BraveBlade2
  • PrototypemindPrototypemind
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    It's not dead but it's far from thriving, and since Nexon can't even bother to keep up with their own contests anymore that should tell you they're just milking it for all it's worth. When it comes to high enhance weaps you're gonna have a hard time, fewer people playing, and fewer people willing to deal with the chance of permanently losing the ability to enhance after +12. Maybe it will change some since there are P2W runes that go up to +15 which not only protect the weapon but increase the rate of success--there are still whales spending money--but I wouldn't hold out hope for a great weapon to come around too often.
    tom50574
  • RadeRade
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    2 months of dailies for a +1 quality coupon is a pretty long wait compared to having a chance at 3 or 4 star right from the start. Crafting low level gear is merely an avenue to level up the skill to allow that benefit for high level stuff, and it's a benefit worth investing in for many players. Past that, it's for vanity items and gear that you like the appearance of that isn't available as drops.

    Airtight items aside, the economy of the game is arguably the healthiest it's ever been. Virtually every drop has non-trivial value and a use worth holding on to them or buying them for. The inflation the NA servers have been suffering from for years has finally died down to a more proper valuation. There are a common items that can be obtained and sold in large quantities for decent sums, uncommon items that have fair value on their own, and rare items that are worth large amounts. Almost all of these items are readily obtainable with reasonable amounts of effort on your own, and generally are in supply on the marketplace as well.

    The Rise update made getting and enhancing gear much easier, much less risky, and much less costly, and they're still rolling out improvements to that in further patches. You don't see people selling highly-enhanced gear anymore because they're trying to make it for themselves first (especially considering how much more potent they've been made), the lack of inflation means there are fewer and fewer people who have the large sums of cash available to make such a purchase for them to sell to, and it's not even clear how much gold the items are actually worth with the reworked economy anyway.

    I'm really tired of seeing all the 'game is dead, Rise killed it' comments everywhere in this community, because frankly, that's not true. The Rise update addressed and fixed the vast majority of core issues with the game that everyone had been complaining about for years. It also changed a lot of things people weren't expecting, but if you look at those changes and give them a chance, it adds up to a better game experience that focuses in on what made the game good in the first place. There are some areas that still need further improvement, but because of how much the developers have been making further adjustments and changes in frequent patches in the Korean client, there's a lot of reason to be hopeful that those areas that are lacking will be filled in over the next couple of months. Rise was designed to rebuild the game's core and give it a solid foundation so that there will be room to grow and create lots of new and interesting experiences.

    What's keeping the game from growing isn't the Rise update - it's the attitude of the players that are so close-minded toward change that are immediately saying the game sucks now and is dead and everyone should stop playing it, while creating biased polls where the only options are agreement. Ironically, many of those people are saying it while they're still playing regularly and putting in several hours on the game each day. That behavior is toxic and pervasive, and as long as it's the norm, the population will never be what it's capable of. I'm not saying you shouldn't offer criticism or voice your complaints, but the vast majority of it is just people satisfying their desire to insult something and jump on the bandwagon without thinking it over for themselves.
    tom50574HariiEnigmaTaroPlaksterMochiSweetosapBabyDaniTehL337SlothPrincessOKAMland 2 others.
  • PrototypemindPrototypemind
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    @Rade Nah fam, taking 8 man out of most of the game/turning raids into regular missions and getting rid of hard mode, making it one and done for enhancing, and doing away with much of crafting, along with other things that players didn't want, and making combat until end game a complete and utter joke very much killed the game. It is the ultimate irony that so many of the QoL changes that players have been begging for over the years finally show up only to be ruined by changes that destroy the core of the game. People aren't whining, they're speaking their mind. I will play here and there, but this will never, ever be my main title again in its current state and I will never spend another dollar with the main Rise changes in place.

    Do not think by being flippant and ignoring player's actual reasons for no longer wanting to be a part of Vindi that you somehow make them invalid. KR and other region players have left by the score as well. Some have stuck around, and some whales are still pumping in money, but the game is not healthy in the ways that it could be.
    tom50574BraveBlade2
  • RadeRade
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    edited August 14, 2017
    Changing from 8 to 4 for the majority of runs is something I support. It forces players to actually pay attention to the boss's attack patterns and learn the mechanics themselves instead of relying on someone else having aggro and letting other players take care of those mechanics, and also reduces the game's excessively high requirements to host compared to joining a party or soloing. I do think there are a number of battles where 8-mans should be readded, mainly those where the mechanics were largely built around it (Braha, Kraken, maybe Cromm/Bark), but they should remain rare and infrequent instead of the norm.

    Turning the lower raids into regular missions is also a change I support. The game doesn't really properly start until you hit season 3 and level 90 content. That's the core of the game, and it has been since well before Rise, but it took far, far too long for new players to reach that point. They've shifted the baselines and condensed the early phases to allow for new players to actually get into the meat of the game instead of playing for months without getting to it. The revamped hero mode allows that lower content to still stay relevant and have a level of challenge, although its implementation is currently incomplete and needs to be filled out more properly.

    The 'one and done' enhancing is something I absolutely support. The old system was downright terrible and required you gambling in an all or nothing risk to have a meaningful chance to progress. Because they've improved the ease with which you can get high-end gear and the ease with which you can get to a moderately high enhancement level, starting over after a single attempt is nowhere near as penalizing as it used to be, and you don't have to farm exorbitant amounts of AP to resurrect your weapon and get back something usable again. They also basically made it impossible to genuinely lose progress, as even when you can't take it any higher, you'll still have the same high-end weapon, and there are options available to pass the majority of upgrades you've spent on it onto another weapon once you get one higher. If you're working with 90 weapons, the most recent patch in Korea added an avenue to get a guaranteed +13 item, without spending a single cent, via new runes purchasable with seals of bravery.

    The majority of crafting hasn't been done away with; it's still there in the same format and simply uses uniform materials that streamline it. The lower ranks of crafting were never used for anything except gaining proficiency to begin with; the range that qualifies as a lower rank has simply been extended, matching the way the early game has been condensed. There are a few problem points that need to be addressed, like readding popular vanity items that no longer appear to obtainable and adding back crafting heavenly leather.

    I never said it was perfect and doesn't have problems that need addressing, but there's ample reason to hope that those problems will continue to be addressed as time goes on. The main area that I do think needs to be addressed is to dial down the massive increase in additional damage's effectiveness - it simply pushes the minimum times on certain content too low with what players can actually obtain now. I'm not being flippant and ignoring the issues players have: I'm pointing out that while some changes aren't good, most are when evaluated more holistically, and the pervading attitude of throwing vitriol about it is doing far more harm to the game than the actual update itself did - and the update did far, far more to improve the game than it did to harm it.
    HariiBabyDaniAerodos
  • BowtacojrBowtacojr
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    Until the next update, then it's back on life support.
    BraveBlade2
  • hornywatermelonhornywatermelon
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    @Rade your ramblings are cool, informative, elegantly phrased 'n' sh*t but you're missing the point. QoL changes (minus AD rebalancing) came at least 3 years too late. The game is but a shadow of its former self playerbase wise.
  • seashorescrollsseashorescrolls
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    Combat wise, this game is still the best even after how long its been out. That's a shame to all the other MMOs who try to be action combat but fail.
    BabyDaniBraveBlade2
  • RhapsodyOfFireRhapsodyOfFire
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    Combat wise, this game is still the best even after how long its been out. That's a shame to all the other MMOs who try to be action combat but fail.

    Fail in what? Are you stuck at the LLR system?

    Sure it has a good combat system but what is best is subjective.
  • RaptorBugRaptorBug
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    No is not dead
  • tom50574tom50574
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    wow , again thank you for the insight everyone
  • HariiHarii
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    I think it's not dead, because there'll always be new players and people who wants to try new characters.

    It hasn't the best activity in the world, but it's not a desert. If you enjoy the game, you'll play it.

    If you don't, stop complaining and..
    Rade wrote: »
    What's keeping the game from growing isn't the Rise update - it's the attitude of the players that are so close-minded toward change that are immediately saying the game sucks now and is dead and everyone should stop playing it, while creating biased polls where the only options are agreement. Ironically, many of those people are saying it while they're still playing regularly and putting in several hours on the game each day. That behavior is toxic and pervasive, and as long as it's the norm, the population will never be what it's capable of. I'm not saying you shouldn't offer criticism or voice your complaints, but the vast majority of it is just people satisfying their desire to insult something and jump on the bandwagon without thinking it over for themselves.

    ..start opening more your mind, or stop playing and release your anger and frustration into a punching bag.

    What Rade is saying it's right. I agree with the Quote, I don't have enough knowledge to support his other statements.

    BabyDaniKaramyth
  • BabyDaniBabyDani
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    also keep in mind that we are waaaaaaaaay more spread out now, compared to the old days when there was just S1 colhen..
    .vindi haz gotten much bigger, but the population kinda hasn't...nexon na isn't really promoting the game, so tell all your friends to join, or else! +fight :*
    Harii
  • VladinoVladino
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    ^ but call only 4 friends because ya won't be able to raid with more T_T (unless royal or neam)
    BabyDaniKingRichRiceBraveBlade2
  • PrototypemindPrototypemind
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    edited August 15, 2017
    Nexon hasn't bothered with their own weekly contest since March. That to me is not a sign of a company staying on top of its game. Further, Nexon cut all communication with players before they dumped Dragon's Nest off to another publisher. I know that is unlikely to happen with Vindi as they produce it in house via DevCat, but if the end is drawing near or things are simply horrible I don't expect it to be acknowledged. The simple fact is that Rise might be doing what the DoL wanted, keeping new players around past very early game, but it has been very divisive for long time players. I and most of the people that I played with are not playing for hours a day and then turning around and pretending otherwise; we simply rarely log in anymore. On one of my accounts that I used to get on daily I got the Returning Mercenary package when I hopped on.

    People are free to see things however they like, and I don't like what I see. I voice it here on the forums, and I make it clear by spending on other games rather than Vindi as are many others. Feel free to enjoy the game if it appeals to you, but don't think that trying to tell anyone else that they just need to suck it up and enjoy the game as is will change that Rise carved the game up in a way that hurt a lot more than it helped. It's harder than ever to obtain capped stats because the resources for it aren't being farmed in near the volume that was occurring.

    I guess time will tell if the new players are willing to stick around and grind through the wall that they hit with 90/95 content, but taking away the community aspect by removing even small incentives like seals and larger parties when it comes to doing former raids doesn't sit well with me and I don't want to support that.
    BraveBlade2MystLord
  • arkaine757arkaine757
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    edited August 15, 2017
    I'm not playing since Rise, i can't tell what's going on right now, but the game is dead to me.

    I already posted complains about this update, i'll not be bothering again, i moved to BDO with 8 other players.

    BraveBlade2