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So EU really does need to change the terminology they use if they don't want any misunderstandings.
However in her ticket it doesn't sound like she was trading gifts at all, especially because she seems to think that only NX for real money is not allowed.
Wow this is getting a bit out of Hand. I feel like people interpret a bit too much here. All I knew while writing the Ticket, (and before) was that Trading NX Items via the Depot Gifting for Gold is legit. And in the Ticket I also tried to make clear that I was not advertising for anything else than Trading NX Gifts for Gold and that my Logs proof that all I did was Trading NX Gifts for Gold. I did not know why my Account had been blocked and just suspected a misunderstanding with the Terms used in Mega.
Also as a note: History does not matter, just advertising it is a ban here. Even if you fail to sell you can still be permabanned.
IMHO: If you advertise clearly that you are Trading NX Gifts for Gold and there is no suspicious activity for any kind of forbidden Trade in your Log History, then I see no reason for Nexon to punish the Player(s) involved in the Trade since they did not break any rules.
And for advertising "unclear" like: "WTS NX 1:800" or similar, the above should be applied to.
Of course if someone is like "WTS NX Codes" Nexon should take appropiate actions against that Player.
However it cannot stay like that. Because from her ticket reply, it sounds like she was 100% breaking the rules.
I Really don't know how you can interpret it like that.
EDIT: Yes that old Block was an unintended Chargeback back in EU Service. I had mentioned it in my other Post, please don't mix it with the Topic because it had been cleared long ago.
I just wanted to point out some stuff. I will end the discussion here from my side.
HF and maybe see you Ingame
@Gewellirious
Normally the first one "Trade NX" would have gotten you banned. If they are not banning for it right now it's probably because they are being lenient due to the merge.
However "selling nx items" doesn't seem like something that would get you banned since you are specifying "nx items".
@LadyFaye
I know your ban was not for that. However, since you posted your ticket and you mentioned that some players were not unbanned after a ticket, it seemed like something that needed to be explained.
I am not sure why you feel it is getting out of hand.
For those that do have bans over selling NX, a ticket like yours would have been seen as them admitting to it. There is no other way to take it actually, and if that was not what you were saying (which you are saying it is not) then there is definitely a problem in the terminology.
If you say you are trading the depot items clearly then that wouldn't lead to a ban, however the "WTS NX" is not clear at all.
As I stated before history doesn't matter though, since its just the advertisement that gets you banned. So just saying "WTS NX" is considered breaking the rules.
@Gewellirious
Normally the first one "Trade NX" would have gotten you banned. If they are not banning for it right now it's probably because they are being lenient due to the merge.
How are you expecting EU players to know that saying 'S> NX' is a crime and gets you banned?
How you expect them to smell that they are 'advertising it in the wrong way'?
Give them a warning if they advertise it the wrong way, dont insta perm ban them.
There is a saying in my country, "If you are in a room with 10 people, you do something, and 9 people tell you that you did wrong, well, then you did wrong — no matter how much you want to think that you did right, or that you are right and they are all wrong." (I guess it sounds a bit like democracy.)
That is a nice thing to say to the people or companies who do something on their own terms, in this case, without even giving a damn about their customers' opinion, but only using falsely and repeatedly "We understand...", when they clearly do not. Sure, it is their freedom to do so, but it is clearly a sign of disrespect towards players, too.
Hence, I must agree with the majority of players on this matter, although I respect Nexon NA staff's overall work and effort.
Also I must say I appreciate Dealer's dedication to the rules, as they must be followed by people, but a little reminder: Rules are created by human beings in a community or society according to their rationality and moral senses, thus they can also be altered by human beings in the same conditions. The rules are neither abiding nor perpetual, but only feeble to human touch.
Now, I shall ask you to cease the conversation here as I think that this matter will not be change just due to some dispute between players and a Volunteer Forum Moderator. Beside this, I suppose that "MARKETPLACE AUCTIONS" is NOT the right category for this kind of interlocution. Either open a new topic in the right category, or spam the Nexon team with mails and phones about this matter until they are willing to change their minds. Thanks!
IGN: Shirobun
Forum Name: ShadowCX
Last known LVL: 90
Last known guild: n/a
Titles: 238
As can be seen, I've been selling tons of Boxes
As per the new rules, I would like to state that Shirobun is half-gearless right now, because I want to main the character Ziegenbein instead. So I'd like him to definitely be on my list now. Here's the data:
IGN: Ziegenbein
Forum Name: ShadowCX
Last known LVL: 90
Last known guild: NewWarriors
Titles: 222
just cause there is a chance of false accusation (which can be easily overwritten if that person is able to prove his innocence, which in turn do help build up their own reputation in a way) doesnt mean that a community scammer list is not needed.
on the side note, how often is it to get permabans on scamming ? devcat doesn't have the official note on this subject and so it just went underground, no one knows if they do do anything or not.
Potential scammers may be:
Low Level
Have cryptic names (xXxScammerxXx, dsghrdthdtrg32w54rt4w, DontTrustMe, etc.)
Have no remarkable equipment
achieved almost no titles
show a lack of language
I've got a feeling that some people just want to be scammed. Does it hurt to hit up the forum and take a look at the trusted NX (gift) seller list and PM them in the game? You can even google it, too. Or does it even hurt to find a seller who isn't suspicious? Or if the seller shows any sign that would conclude that he might be a potential scammer, why do you even send the payment first? My cerebrum simply cannot comprehend it. The fault in this matter is on both sides — one player is a despicable scammer, the other one is a foolish ignorant.
Now, if he was really scammed, the best thing for him to do would be to send a ticket to the NX Staff along with some evidences. Unfortunately, the society we live in is filled with mental poor people who will try their best to scam you for their own benefit. The best is not to take chances with suspicious people.
@omoisama
Edit instead of double posting when you make a post about the same idea (especially when the posts are so short). Thank you. And Devcat has nothing to do with this, they are just the game developers. Nexon, the publisher, is dealing with this matter their way.
Nevertheless, it's unfortunate what has happened, but this discussion doesn't have its place here as the player isn't on the list, thus I would ask you to stop spamming.
_____________________________________
@Solanah
An update upon your progress is required, otherwise you might be erased from the list. Thank you!
@All
The original post have been updated with several new terms. I'm asking everyone to take a look. Thank you!
just cause there is a chance of false accusation (which can be easily overwritten if that person is able to prove his innocence, which in turn do help build up their own reputation in a way) doesnt mean that a community scammer list is not needed.
on the side note, how often is it to get permabans on scamming ? devcat doesn't have the official note on this subject and so it just went underground, no one knows if they do do anything or not.
All of the trades are at your own risk, so permabans are not common nor should they be expected.
Also please do not name anyone as a scammer on these forums, since accusations like that are considered harassment and will be removed.
I have been trying to see where this thread actually fits by the way, since its not a thread I've had to deal with before.
At this point it seems more like a discussion for the server section rather than marketplace so I will be moving it there.
Also please stop using the term "NX seller" to describe these players. NX selling is not allowed, so using a term like that only serves to confuse players.
@Dealer
I cannot see any reason for this thread to be at the ”Europe Chat” category. Its purpose is NX gifts trading, thus trading. People started spamming in my thread without any permission from me. Wouldn't it be a Volunteer Forum Moderator's job to keep the spammers away? If people start spamming posts at any trading thread you will automatically move it to chat instead of sanctioning the ones that are disturbing around? My apologise, but I made this thread in such a way people can post a request to be added to the list, not for chit-chat.
I'm kindly asking you to move the thread back in its original category and take action upon future spammers. I have no power to deal with them, but you do.
Its actually your comments that caused it to be moved.
In your example, if the OP isn't buying, selling, or price checking anything in a market thread then yes it would be moved.
Spammers will always be taken care of, however you can report them so we can find out about them easier.
Taking a better look, it's not me the one who started the off-topic, but yes, I am to blame for continuing it, too. I also put an end to it because it was useless in a trading thread. Now, the last discussion burst without any correlation to me.
All of the trades are at your own risk, so permabans are not common nor should they be expected.
Even so, (NX) scammers always were permabanned on EU. I very much hope NA enforces a similar policy.
No it is at your own risk.
No repercussions for scamming? This is gonna be fun . Just because something is at a user's own risk doesn't mean it can't be acted upon.
I guess a known scammers list would actually be beneficial now. Shame.
it's obvious by merging the server and going for global account, Nexon is running low on budget and can't afford to hire that many people in different places and deal with different regulations at once, for sure they won't have people to do anything about whoever that got scammed, in games where the barrier to entry is almost non-existed, as long as u have a wifi and semi ok pc.
also vindi is now practically an NA free to play game, and so this is the type of customer service on player dispute that people can expect to get for free ---- none.
I do feel sorry for starting up this topic, but it's bound to happen one day or another as long as people are still around
Forum link: my forum profile
Main: IdrialLAdyofLight
Titles: 653
Alts: Praesidia, Amysha, Everika, Fornost
Lv: 90
Stats: ABC 250+
Guild: BlackTornado (I'm the Guild Master of BlackTornado).
Screenshots Gift History:
So if I get this straight, people like me who lost their main characters after migration, starts way back to level one, but still have NX for Gift Trading are kinda screwed ? I don't think you can trust someone just by looking at their level and their titles, a scammer can as well level up to 90, get some titles, and pretend to do Gift trading, and still scams customers afterwards.
As the last list hasn't given any sign of life since the half of the last year, I guess we can safely assume that it's dead. Thus, I decided to take control over this thread. Hopefully no one has anything against it.
@All:
Check the seller's stats before you intend to buy NX Gifts. So far, the most recent scamming cases we processed, low level sellers (between lv.1 to lv. 30) were involved. You are highly recommended to avoid those sellers and only trust players where you know they spent more than a week of playing time to Vindictus.
Potential scammers may be:
Low Level
Have cryptic names (xXxScammerxXx, dsghrdthdtrg32w54rt4w, DontTrustMe, etc.)
Have no remarkable equipment
achieved almost no titles
show a lack of language
Meh, anyways, I'll still try my chance then, but as you will see, I had to restart. I don't especially want to get on this list right now, but I just wanted to make people know I'm currently Gift Trading.
In-game name : Kahlua (Formerly Voltagia)
Forum Name : Voltagia
Last known level : 1 (Formerly 83-85)
Last known guild : None (Formerly leader of a level 20 guild for beginner named Fear_Unlimited)
Titles : 0 (Formerly about 130-150, ain't a title rusher)
Screenshot of old character (with also someone who wanted to trade some NX Gift from me at that time) :
Don't have screenshots from supply depot list at that time, but I do remember some old clients (NekoFenrir, if he's still playing)
Let's just say I have to rebuy some equip to best prepare the end-game levels
I currently have 101.000 NX available, feel free to call me for some trading, so I can put more screenshots of the business later.
Comments
Wow this is getting a bit out of Hand. I feel like people interpret a bit too much here. All I knew while writing the Ticket, (and before) was that Trading NX Items via the Depot Gifting for Gold is legit. And in the Ticket I also tried to make clear that I was not advertising for anything else than Trading NX Gifts for Gold and that my Logs proof that all I did was Trading NX Gifts for Gold. I did not know why my Account had been blocked and just suspected a misunderstanding with the Terms used in Mega.
IMHO: If you advertise clearly that you are Trading NX Gifts for Gold and there is no suspicious activity for any kind of forbidden Trade in your Log History, then I see no reason for Nexon to punish the Player(s) involved in the Trade since they did not break any rules.
And for advertising "unclear" like: "WTS NX 1:800" or similar, the above should be applied to.
Of course if someone is like "WTS NX Codes" Nexon should take appropiate actions against that Player.
I Really don't know how you can interpret it like that.
EDIT: Yes that old Block was an unintended Chargeback back in EU Service. I had mentioned it in my other Post, please don't mix it with the Topic because it had been cleared long ago.
I just wanted to point out some stuff. I will end the discussion here from my side.
HF and maybe see you Ingame
Normally the first one "Trade NX" would have gotten you banned. If they are not banning for it right now it's probably because they are being lenient due to the merge.
However "selling nx items" doesn't seem like something that would get you banned since you are specifying "nx items".
@LadyFaye
I know your ban was not for that. However, since you posted your ticket and you mentioned that some players were not unbanned after a ticket, it seemed like something that needed to be explained.
I am not sure why you feel it is getting out of hand.
For those that do have bans over selling NX, a ticket like yours would have been seen as them admitting to it. There is no other way to take it actually, and if that was not what you were saying (which you are saying it is not) then there is definitely a problem in the terminology.
If you say you are trading the depot items clearly then that wouldn't lead to a ban, however the "WTS NX" is not clear at all.
As I stated before history doesn't matter though, since its just the advertisement that gets you banned. So just saying "WTS NX" is considered breaking the rules.
How are you expecting EU players to know that saying 'S> NX' is a crime and gets you banned?
How you expect them to smell that they are 'advertising it in the wrong way'?
Give them a warning if they advertise it the wrong way, dont insta perm ban them.
That is a nice thing to say to the people or companies who do something on their own terms, in this case, without even giving a damn about their customers' opinion, but only using falsely and repeatedly "We understand...", when they clearly do not. Sure, it is their freedom to do so, but it is clearly a sign of disrespect towards players, too.
Hence, I must agree with the majority of players on this matter, although I respect Nexon NA staff's overall work and effort.
Also I must say I appreciate Dealer's dedication to the rules, as they must be followed by people, but a little reminder: Rules are created by human beings in a community or society according to their rationality and moral senses, thus they can also be altered by human beings in the same conditions. The rules are neither abiding nor perpetual, but only feeble to human touch.
Now, I shall ask you to cease the conversation here as I think that this matter will not be change just due to some dispute between players and a Volunteer Forum Moderator. Beside this, I suppose that "MARKETPLACE AUCTIONS" is NOT the right category for this kind of interlocution. Either open a new topic in the right category, or spam the Nexon team with mails and phones about this matter until they are willing to change their minds. Thanks!
Forum Name: ShadowCX
Last known LVL: 90
Last known guild: n/a
Titles: 238
As can be seen, I've been selling tons of Boxes
As per the new rules, I would like to state that Shirobun is half-gearless right now, because I want to main the character Ziegenbein instead. So I'd like him to definitely be on my list now. Here's the data:
IGN: Ziegenbein
Forum Name: ShadowCX
Last known LVL: 90
Last known guild: NewWarriors
Titles: 222
on the side note, how often is it to get permabans on scamming ? devcat doesn't have the official note on this subject and so it just went underground, no one knows if they do do anything or not.
Low Level
Have cryptic names (xXxScammerxXx, dsghrdthdtrg32w54rt4w, DontTrustMe, etc.)
Have no remarkable equipment
achieved almost no titles
show a lack of language
I've got a feeling that some people just want to be scammed. Does it hurt to hit up the forum and take a look at the trusted NX (gift) seller list and PM them in the game? You can even google it, too. Or does it even hurt to find a seller who isn't suspicious? Or if the seller shows any sign that would conclude that he might be a potential scammer, why do you even send the payment first? My cerebrum simply cannot comprehend it. The fault in this matter is on both sides — one player is a despicable scammer, the other one is a foolish ignorant.
Now, if he was really scammed, the best thing for him to do would be to send a ticket to the NX Staff along with some evidences. Unfortunately, the society we live in is filled with mental poor people who will try their best to scam you for their own benefit. The best is not to take chances with suspicious people.
@omoisama
Edit instead of double posting when you make a post about the same idea (especially when the posts are so short). Thank you. And Devcat has nothing to do with this, they are just the game developers. Nexon, the publisher, is dealing with this matter their way.
Nevertheless, it's unfortunate what has happened, but this discussion doesn't have its place here as the player isn't on the list, thus I would ask you to stop spamming.
_____________________________________
@Solanah
An update upon your progress is required, otherwise you might be erased from the list. Thank you!
@All
The original post have been updated with several new terms. I'm asking everyone to take a look. Thank you!
All of the trades are at your own risk, so permabans are not common nor should they be expected.
Also please do not name anyone as a scammer on these forums, since accusations like that are considered harassment and will be removed.
I have been trying to see where this thread actually fits by the way, since its not a thread I've had to deal with before.
At this point it seems more like a discussion for the server section rather than marketplace so I will be moving it there.
Also please stop using the term "NX seller" to describe these players. NX selling is not allowed, so using a term like that only serves to confuse players.
I cannot see any reason for this thread to be at the ”Europe Chat” category. Its purpose is NX gifts trading, thus trading. People started spamming in my thread without any permission from me. Wouldn't it be a Volunteer Forum Moderator's job to keep the spammers away? If people start spamming posts at any trading thread you will automatically move it to chat instead of sanctioning the ones that are disturbing around? My apologise, but I made this thread in such a way people can post a request to be added to the list, not for chit-chat.
I'm kindly asking you to move the thread back in its original category and take action upon future spammers. I have no power to deal with them, but you do.
In your example, if the OP isn't buying, selling, or price checking anything in a market thread then yes it would be moved.
Spammers will always be taken care of, however you can report them so we can find out about them easier.
No it is at your own risk.
I guess a known scammers list would actually be beneficial now. Shame.
it's obvious by merging the server and going for global account, Nexon is running low on budget and can't afford to hire that many people in different places and deal with different regulations at once, for sure they won't have people to do anything about whoever that got scammed, in games where the barrier to entry is almost non-existed, as long as u have a wifi and semi ok pc.
also vindi is now practically an NA free to play game, and so this is the type of customer service on player dispute that people can expect to get for free ---- none.
I do feel sorry for starting up this topic, but it's bound to happen one day or another as long as people are still around
Main: IdrialLAdyofLight
Titles: 653
Alts: Praesidia, Amysha, Everika, Fornost
Lv: 90
Stats: ABC 250+
Guild: BlackTornado (I'm the Guild Master of BlackTornado).
Screenshots Gift History:
Guild WhySoSerious
221 Titles
Link to zoom and see better : https://s24.postimg.org/keswi2qhx/image.jpg and http://i.imgur.com/Dk3l41q.jpg
Forum Name: Dolore
Last known LVL: 90
Last known guild: DestructiveDemons
Titles: 300
I selled more nx last month... i sell NX every month and when i dont need one.
Link of the immage: imgur.com/a/qf4PT
Meh, anyways, I'll still try my chance then, but as you will see, I had to restart. I don't especially want to get on this list right now, but I just wanted to make people know I'm currently Gift Trading.
In-game name : Kahlua (Formerly Voltagia)
Forum Name : Voltagia
Last known level : 1 (Formerly 83-85)
Last known guild : None (Formerly leader of a level 20 guild for beginner named Fear_Unlimited)
Titles : 0 (Formerly about 130-150, ain't a title rusher)
Screenshot of old character (with also someone who wanted to trade some NX Gift from me at that time) :
Don't have screenshots from supply depot list at that time, but I do remember some old clients (NekoFenrir, if he's still playing)
Let's just say I have to rebuy some equip to best prepare the end-game levels
I currently have 101.000 NX available, feel free to call me for some trading, so I can put more screenshots of the business later.
See you in game.