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About Crossgun kais dodge

Arrow95Arrow95
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in Kai
Any Koreans know if they are "Fixing" Crossgun kais dodge? right now its a joke, Bows dodge 2 but i wont get into that 2 much salt to even talk about one of kais dodges.

Ps. If you dont have anything important/nice to say then keep it to you're self, rather not deal with all the salt, like the last thread about Crossgun kais dodge(100+replys)

Comments

  • 2edgy4u2edgy4u
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    They aren't. Can I have your stuff when you quit?
  • ArixArix
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    They fixed it with the Neamhain patch.
  • TheNewKaiTheNewKai
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    edited February 15, 2017
    The last update fixed his dodge. Before was considered 'broken'. So just deal with the slower dodge, yes it sucks but so does nexon. :D
  • jeddyhijeddyhi
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    By fixing it do you mean nerfed it so it now sucks?
  • AequipondiumAequipondium
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    A Kai friend of mine is still the top dog in terms of dps though, I only ever see him really struggle in einrach - which most characters do. But yeah so far no changes.
  • Arrow95Arrow95
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    Yes they did fix the so called "Glitch" for Crossgun kais dodge, as in right now hes dodge is 2 slow for pretty much all the new content(S3) he needs a Increase in its Anmation Speed, but looking at bows trash dodge nothing will get done.
  • JessGameJessGame
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    Arrow95 wrote: »
    Yes they did fix the so called "Glitch" for Crossgun kais dodge, as in right now hes dodge is 2 slow for pretty much all the new content(S3) he needs a Increase in its Anmation Speed, but looking at bows trash dodge nothing will get done.

    It's no salt but i totally disagree.The real lost you guys probably suffer from that change is to gain distance and close up to the boss faster,aside of that everything is dodge-able.In Neahmain for example she will sometime teleport from one end of the map to the other repitively and you have to chase her wich can create a discomfort depending on how fast you can travel and how good your stamina system is.

    But in term of actully dodging attacks,Kai is definitely ok with the way the dodge is right now:


    <video>



    -19:32,look at all the purple circles on the ground
    -19:57,the 4 hit combo she does is rather fast,sudden and the hit boxes of it are tricky,if you can dodge that there should not be many attacks that would cause you much problems.It's all timing and positioning.

    At last,they won't revert it so all you can really do is to get used to it.Anyway that's just my personal opinion/observation on his dodge after taking some time to test it against several situations.I also find his dodge system to be very forgiving stamina wise.

    Once again it's no salt but simply that i see some kai in game or in video who have already greatly adjusted to the change,so im just giving you the information that you can do it as well.To be honest i never developped the habit of using the technique wich was fixed.You probably still have the habit registered and need some time to get used.In a situation like that i would probably just go into battles solo and focus on dodging everything without bothering with attacking,until i feel comfortable and than after work on my transitions between dodges and attacks.



  • Arrow95Arrow95
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    Neams 4 hit combo isnt really fast a good amount of time bewteen them, yes timeing and positioning will get you very far, but Certain Situations it will be impossable for gun to invul Muiti attacks, thats all am saying no matter how good you are his dodge as a big limitation, while other Chars are very forgiving Blocks/2nd options to get away or invul all gun as is his basic dodge. Then again look at bow kais dodge, rip fun times with gun
  • JessGameJessGame
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    Arrow95 wrote: »
    Neams 4 hit combo isnt really fast a good amount of time bewteen them, yes timeing and positioning will get you very far, but Certain Situations it will be impossable for gun to invul Muiti attacks, thats all am saying no matter how good you are his dodge as a big limitation, while other Chars are very forgiving Blocks/2nd options to get away or invul all gun as is his basic dodge. Then again look at bow kais dodge, rip fun times with gun

    It's not false,but it also depends on how you see it.

    My 1st impressions on doing Neahmain with Sylas was that his dodging system combined with the stamina consumption of it felt weak.Now im slowly getting used to it and finding the little tricks that makes it viable,more enjoyable and efficient but it took a lot of runs.That's how much i like playing the class i play,simple as that.

    I see what you mean,like especially Delia and Arisha have 2 quick defensive transition alternatives wich are very conveniant but in overall most classes have their pros and cons somewhere.To be fair Kai is considered a ranged class wich means he still has massive damage power from distance and giving him a strong dodge for me is not all that necessary.

    I still think that if you really like playing Kai,it's only a matter of time and you will get comfortable with his dodge.You where probably around 4 years ago and know that most classes have caught up to bosses mechanisms by a lot.Everybody as the right to their opinion,but making things even more conveniant at this point would just make the game even easier with no real sense of challenge wich can be boring to some.

    Kai still has conveniant points regardless like he can tank hits while in some animations,takes damage but still can attack without getting stunned.Of course you can't use that against some bosses or in certain situation but im just saying all characters have advantages somewhere.

    Some situations will be more difficult to deal with however with:

    -dodge
    -doge+spin smash
    -dodge+dodge
    -dodge+positioning+dodge
    -running+dodge

    -dodge+dodge
    -dodge+dodge grapple
    -dodge+twister kick
    -sprint+dodge

    We should have enough tools to do well.It's really about keeping range while transitioning from dodges to attack very quickly and with good precision,because after taking distance,sometime the boss will be already tracking you while your trying to aim properly your attack and that adds a little struggle of aiming/triggering your attacks properly....that's also what prevents Kai to be extrêmely boring and broken.

    Regardless of what many thinks,Kai still requires a great mastery to be played very well,if they give him a dodging system that is too strong,than there is nothing much you have to watch out for,even his stamina consumption is very forgiving.

    Im pretty sure you will get used to it.




  • Arrow95Arrow95
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    edited February 18, 2017
    I do fine in Neam with bow/gun after 50 practice solo runs with each of them, only problem gun after you get used to neam is in party play you wont always be close and the 2 purple circles she shoots out at her side can be hard to get out or invul, and in the 3th phase her aoe which she shoots the purple wave(drains you of stam and she can play pinball on you) can be hard for gun to get away if she comes after you.

    I wouldnt say lets give kai mand shields/block plus bolt roll back but gun kai does need a little upgrade from his dodge as in right now

    Ideas: Spin Smash should get affected by Attspeed
    :Half the anamation of Spin smash gives invul sort of like sword lann with his 2 dodges
    :a little faster dodge
    Also beacuse i do main bow, bows invul on his dodge is just bad 0.33 secs should get bumped up to 0.50 if any lag then rip dodgeing, even in solo play have to dodge at the right moment the enemeys attack hits you and even sometimes the anmation will last longer then the invul.

    Am just not talking about neam, she isnt that bad when you get used to her, am just talking in general

    Side note Rapid Fire still isnt affect by Attspeed it would be nice just saying
  • ArtemiasArtemias
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    xKai's dodge is fine. It was broken as hell and I main Kai. This "nerf" everyone keeps complaining about isn't that bad, be grateful you have .6 seconds of iframes. There's always a way to get around attacks that seem impossible to get out of, all you need to do is start hitting the practice room and find different strategies rather than dwell on the past or blaming this "nerf".

    Bow Kai I slightly agree should be bumped up a little, maybe not .5 as that might be a little unbalanced in my opinion (maybe at highest .4). With the tools he has, he is mainly party dps, not so much a "solo" oriented character that needs agro like Arisha (needs agro for drain), Sword Lann (needs aggro for crit buff), and Fiona (needs agro for shield bash) Hurk etc. etc. The one main complaint I have about Bow Kai is when you shoot whether a longbow or shortbow arrow, there's a delay after you dodge (can't spam dodge as fast for like 1-2 dodges). other than that everything is fine to me.

    Lag is and always will be an issue so you really can't do anything about it.

    Learning the hitbox, boss movements/AI rather than solely relying on your reflexes helps out a lot too. People have said 0-hit solos with Spear Lann is impossible with his dodge. But it's definitely doable. This also applies to Bow Kai or any other class.

  • Arrow95Arrow95
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    edited February 23, 2017
    This is where a disagree, all crossgun kai as is his single dodge where every other char as a backup plan like i said, no matter how good or how much you practice you do some of the bosses attacks will be impossable
    "be grateful you have .6 seconds of iframes" how about spear lanns just got a boast in there dodge, with the neam update spear lanns got 0.13 secs of invul added on to their dodge.
    i still stand Crossgun kai "Needs" a better dodge then atm a little faster one then as in right now beacuse of chain attacks
    and also the attspeed stat would be nice if it affected kai more(Spin smash,Perforate)
    Seigaku
  • ArtemiasArtemias
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    To be honest Spear Lann needed/deserved that buff, he has to constantly be upfront to do well. You shouldn't be upfront and personal with xgun (post neam update), unless the moment calls for it. (Tiny boss, need to land six shooter)

    Perforate is fine as is, its firing rate is pretty decent. Spin smash...meh it gets the job done (extra distance/avoid attacks by using angled spin smashing, superarmor)

    Im just curious, which set of multi attacks are you referring to? I haven't really soloed anything since neam came out.
  • Arrow95Arrow95
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    am talking in gerenal, like glas's double sweep attack, theres lots of attack chains where Crossgun kais dodge will not fast enough to dodge the 2nd hit or w.e and plus getting spin smash affected by attspeed or a little faster dodge like 10% would be nice for the extra distince.
  • Mercer_Mercer_
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    I'd have to agree with Artemias. I pretty much play Kai exclusively. I've only discovered the bolt dodge in the past year and all I can say is that I haven't really encountered a situation where the bolt dodge is crucial. The dodge was mainly a luxury. It made for easier "oh sht" moments in solo and farming a lot faster. But that's pretty much it. As for that Glas two swipe. Dodge towards him the second swipe won't hit you. As for Neam's 4 hit combo. Every single attack is dodgeable consecutively. As for her purple wave attack. Keep dodging forward and don't look back. All in all, yeah it sucks Nexon removed the dodge but you'll live. Would I mind if Nexon readjusted his dodge? Of course not but I wouldn't hold my breath. The dodge now is sufficient as far as new content goes.
  • xCyclonusxCyclonus
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    Arrow95 wrote: »
    am talking in gerenal, like glas's double sweep attack, theres lots of attack chains where Crossgun kais dodge will not fast enough to dodge the 2nd hit or w.e and plus getting spin smash affected by attspeed or a little faster dodge like 10% would be nice for the extra distince.

    Not even with hunting party buff activated?
  • Arrow95Arrow95
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    edited February 24, 2017
    Hunting Paty helps, but cant have it up 100% of the time
    Never said i was having problems with neam i know every attack is "Dodgeable" but still i will stand on it Crossgun does "need a little something" if it is attspeed affected spin smashes/ a little faster dodge/ maybe what sylas as for his dodge after his first dodge his second one is faster then the rest. far is new content goes Crossgun wont be able to solo dullahan, his attacks will be 2 fast for crossgun to dodge.
  • ArtemiasArtemias
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    Since the raid is not even out yet, we can't say for sure he can't solo it. By looking at his attacks I believe we can find ways to avoid it.

    Don't say you can't if you haven't even attempted it yet. Even if KR players says you can't, you won't know for sure unless you try it out and see for yourself.
  • Arrow95Arrow95
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    Am making a juggment call based on the Bow kais solo of dullahan, his chain attacks are 2 fast even for bow kai to dodge into most times, but this is my last post about crossgun kais dodge, getting a little tried of it, he "needs" a little something more to dodge attacks or a backup option for his dodge as simple as that.
  • SeigakuSeigaku
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    edited February 25, 2017
    Arrow95 wrote: »
    This is where a disagree, all crossgun kai as is his single dodge where every other char as a backup plan like i said, no matter how good or how much you practice you do some of the bosses attacks will be impossable
    "be grateful you have .6 seconds of iframes" how about spear lanns just got a boast in there dodge, with the neam update spear lanns got 0.13 secs of invul added on to their dodge.
    i still stand Crossgun kai "Needs" a better dodge then atm a little faster one then as in right now beacuse of chain attacks
    and also the attspeed stat would be nice if it affected kai more(Spin smash,Perforate)

    This sums it up. Other characters have other options to dodge, or gain distance (hell, even gaining distance is considered dodging). It is very crucial to provide alternative rather than all we have is our single dodge with a long delay in between. People who think the Kai's dodge is fine probably been salty with the past dodge glitch.

    A quick fix can be as simple as reducing the delay between dodges. Hoping for other skill/alternative will probably far fetched.