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item destruction upon failure should have never been a feature in the first place, why not return the weapon enhance level to 0 instead of breaking it , the only thing it does is penalise people .
item destruction upon failure should have never been a feature in the first place, why not return the weapon enhance level to 0 instead of breaking it , the only thing it does is penalise people .
seal shop should have never been a feature in the first place. why not remove seal shop.
seal shop is the main reason the game has gond down. i remember when seal shop has not been implemented yet the game is thriving lots of players are playing. but when it was implemented the game is hurting so much.
to think of it every time nexon puts the rare drops on the seal shop the economy of the game restart to zero then stabilize but every time they do this lots of players stops playing cause their hard earned armor set or rare items has become useless cause other players can get it easy.
.1 some one should start a pole if we should remove seal shop entirely
in my opinion if we want the game to keep getting better we should remove seal shop
this are just my own opinion and obervations. thanks
item destruction upon failure should have never been a feature in the first place, why not return the weapon enhance level to 0 instead of breaking it , the only thing it does is penalise people .
LOL I don't get why you people still waste your time with this game. Every time I come to the forums there's new features that only punish the player. No mats returned after boom. Now you need to be lvl 90 to get boomed gear back. This game is a freaking joke already. A complete waste of time.
item destruction upon failure should have never been a feature in the first place, why not return the weapon enhance level to 0 instead of breaking it , the only thing it does is penalise people .
LOL I don't get why you people still waste your time with this game. Every time I come to the forums there's new features that only punish the player. No mats returned after boom. Now you need to be lvl 90 to get boomed gear back. This game is a freaking joke already. A complete waste of time.
Yea that is pretty much one of the million other reason i can't stand playing this game for more than 1-3 months and end up quitting for a year or two , i miss the good old time when no one gave a about enhancement and those awful attack requirement boat.
One thing I've started noticing when it comes to the small changes like this nothing is really....noted as a patch notes. I know major updates they get noted but not changes like this even though this is kind of a big deal. Sure the game states the message but no one really reads that (to be fair this subject is a double edge sword at this point because it's more or less the fault of both parties in the end). I suggest even if the change is small but does change some sort of gameplay experience it gets noted with some sort of details ahead of time. I can help with that since I play on KR and a lot of the game changing updates you all receive as well. That way confusion is cleared up among both parties. +best
I disagree with all of this. I think they're trying to find ways to drive the enormous inflation out of our economy. Ours is the bar-none worst. No other region suffers inflation like we do. I think that the prices of orange materials in the past (ex: 70-100m for a solid), were ridiculous. Further, I think that the prices for scrolls was especially silly (ex: 90m for immoral). And driving out inflation is good for players and good for Nexon.
When prices on items are too high, where do players (the ones who don't like to play by the rules) go? They go to buy illegal gold from third parties. That's taking revenue away from Nexon. Its not just the spammers in Channels 1-5. There are lots of websites out there. Some gold is sold for cash by other players. But some of these are scammers; and scam sites. And that doesn't just hurt Nexon, it hurts the player too.
I'm hoping we can drive it down far enough that high enhance weapons can be purchased with gold from a single character. Gold cap being 2.1B per character means that a portion of the gold has to come from another character. It leaves the door wide open for players to be scammed. And we know there are scammers in this game. It's shameful, with the population as low as it is. But they don't care if players feelings are hurt, or they leave the game and never come back. Maybe Gold cap per char should be raised. That way the person trying to purchase the item can't be scammed.
I like this game as much as anyone. And I've had my fair share of luck, good and bad. And i have never bought gold and never will. But when you have to farm as much as I do(mine is the RNG that has gotten 3 scrolls in 2 whole years, yet I have 2 fully scrolled and very well-geared mains), you start to wonder if its worth it. Before I got a gnoll chieftain pet, I bought mine bombs 1000 at a time.
I think the best piece of advice comes from the player above( i dont read korean), is that Nexon NA needs to be more transparent and try harder to give players more full and complete disclosure. While I am understanding to an extent, I'm sure many players felt this was a slap to the face. Especially those first few who blew up gear and were shocked to see that they got nothing back.
You do realize it is all supply and demand. Supply for gold is high, supply of good mats is low. This AP change has actually made the supply lower, so if anything prices are higher... but we still have the seal shop so all it really does is affect elixir + paradise stones. (And maybe it makes a +15s worth a bit more, but I doubt that since you couldn't sell a weapon already blown.)
The only really easy thing nexon could to to combat our inflation would be to dramatically increase all the drops of key items, or lower the number of mats needs/increase success rate. But then it would get to the point where folks don't bother using runes and of course nexon doesn't want to loose that $$.
@ikevi - Yes, I understand the most basic concept of economics.: eye roll: Thanks for looking at the smallest part of the picture. The seal shop is more than able to compensate players for the decrease in supply caused by yolo afficiandos. You dont see as many on the market because those from the seal shop are bound. But the amount of orange pieces a player can acquire is limited only by the number of bravery seals they can earn, and that has been increased dramatically(Abyssal arena, Ein Lacher) I wont do the math for you, but its way more than 140/wk. Let me think - will i pay exorbitant prices on the mp? or will i use the 1800+ seals I have? Sounds like free shards to me.
Also, consider the fact that we're going to be fully merged with european servers soon. They'll leave the game entirely if they believe they'll be forced to deal with the problems that NA has refused to deal with in the past. You think its like this over there? Most r7 scrolls are under 10m.
As for folks not bothering to use runes, that happens now. Why do you think the prhase "YOLO" became so popular in this game? Allow me to direct you to youtube, where you can find videos of players trying to enhance 14 or more weapons from +10 at a time. Hell, the majority of old school players who are still left don't even bother with elixirs at brynns. R7? no brynns, if its gonna work its gonna work.
The only part of the picture i dont get is the gold bots....Back in october, before any of this happened, they spammed messages about $11USD/100m. Now that everything has gotten dramatically cheaper, they're spamming 29-31USD/100m. So, entire market got cheaper, and gold became more expensive? Just an observation- I still do, and will for always, not support or condone gold buying.
@Rizzle Good grief I don't know why I am bothering to respond, but here it is.
1) You are posting in a thread about ap restoring changes. (In particular the focus is on enhancing... enchanting never gave you mats, and unless enchant runes are cheap/event you usually only scroll after you manage a +10 or higher...) 2)The entire thread is from people saying they don't like the change. (30K ap to get back a weapon/blow it back up and get nothing in return stinks.) 3) Your first post was that you don't agree with the entire thread. 4) You then go on about inflation/rng/gold buying and who knows what... Which I pointed out has nothing to do with this thread, and if anything the new rules concerning restoring items make it so that 50% of the mats we used to get back is no longer possible, so they are in fact making inflation worse. (Note all items you got back weren't bound, so if you bought all items from seals... suddenly you had 4 more orange shards in the market instead of 2.) 5) I have no clue how ES etc related to the topic, hence I just stuck with inflation. We can chat offline if you really want to go into the dumb rng that is ES/Brynn. But we are not arguing that this RNG system is good... The thread is arguing that the last thing we want is to make RNG hurt us more. 6) Do you have any data behind your statements concerning YOLO? Because most everyone I know uses runes we get from buying airtight or events. From my experience one YOLOs if they don't care about the item... IE it isn't worth anything, it is already bound and they have one better, or they are going to stop playing. If they could get a bunch of gold from the item (like you are stating they could) then they wouldn't do it. (And usually it is that we start with 14 or more +10 weapons trying for a +15... that isn't YOLO that is the only way you have any good chance of a +13 let alone a +15.) 7) The EU server will start with 0 gold inflation. Go play on the Australia server and show me where all the gold is there. This issue is just a West/East problem. (Australia's problem is that if you want anything you have to farm it yourself, hence this ap restore change is again bad.)
This thread is just for folks to QQ about the fact that they can't get weapons back till they are lv 90 and that the second boom no longer gives you anything in return. And I guess the fast that there was no official notice about this change till this thread.
@Rizzle Good grief I don't know why I am bothering to respond, but here it is.
I don't know which line above pulled your short hairs, but I dont care. If you can't see how it's all related, I'm just kinda sad for you. You'll...nah. I was gonna say something inspiring to give you hope for the future - Understand one day, get the bigger picture one day, grow up, etc... But the truth is you probably won't, whatever it is.
I know you'll talk trash after i post this. Go for it. It doesn't mean anything. Hope it makes ya feel better, cuz apparently you're angry about something. -bye *Rizzle has left the thread.
i agree with Rade. After booming your weapon once there is no reason to try and enhance it again, you will lose the millions or hundred of millions you put into a weapon. You should be able to AP restore more than just once, even more so after the change where you can't get mats back after second boom, so it makes it impossible to get end game gear. 1 step foward and 10 steps back seems the right way to put it.
Ok so why is it still 20kap+ to restore a 90 weapon if your taking out mats from 2nd try? You can farm up new mats for another weapon way faster than getting the AP..
I think they're just trying to make everyone quit so they can take the game down and put it six feet under since we're just beating a dead horse now, no?
Well if people want unlimited wep restoration. Would be nice to Double the AP amount it cost every time they do it? That way people would play often farm AP and so on. Try enhance their already failed wep again? This will cause tho the amount of AP storage to be increase? Idk. However, People do qq too much for not having a +15. So nexon should do something.
Yeah...had my only weapon that I've been farming blow up. Just wish AP restore allowed us to do it more than once. Guess I'll come back to the game when that does happen.
ima pretty new player, comming from wow, gw2 and blade and soul. these were all different gear methods for the endgame. i must say when i heared about permanet destruvtion of endgame gear i was a little scared, this would be too demoralizing to me. and im only lvl 70 so im not even there yet and cant rly give an opinion. but jsut the thought that i have to pay hundreds of millions for a good endgame weapon and there will be 50'% chance my weapon breaks permanently makes me dont even want to touch the game anymore.
im sure there are real money ways to get what you want, but this whole system seems kinda weird to me. so my endgame would pretty much just be trying to retain a good weapon just to gamble it away with the next enchantment. im sure i didnt understand the system completely yet. but what i gathered so far is rly turning me off tbh
ima pretty new player, comming from wow, gw2 and blade and soul. these were all different gear methods for the endgame. i must say when i heared about permanet destruvtion of endgame gear i was a little scared, this would be too demoralizing to me. and im only lvl 70 so im not even there yet and cant rly give an opinion. but jsut the thought that i have to pay hundreds of millions for a good endgame weapon and there will be 50'% chance my weapon breaks permanently makes me dont even want to touch the game anymore.
im sure there are real money ways to get what you want, but this whole system seems kinda weird to me. so my endgame would pretty much just be trying to retain a good weapon just to gamble it away with the next enchantment. im sure i didnt understand the system completely yet. but what i gathered so far is rly turning me off tbh
The permanent destruction is mainly when you try to enhance a weapon past +10 without special, very expensive, time limited runes. You can always use enchant runes to protect your gear.
In theory, you dont "need" to go beyond +10. In reality, the game massively encourages it. Attack speed and the attack cap mean that after you get your enchants sorted out, you pretty much need to go beyond +10 to improve your gear, especially for slow characters that need lots of attack speed. This is especailly true because bosses in season 2 and beyond are designed for parties near or at the attack cap...+10 level 60 weapons were sufficient for roch raids and was easy to get the mats for, +10 level 90 oj weapons without full enchants do nearly no damage in s3 raids and are much harder to make. People are therefore encouraged to gamble their weapons...more often than not, they lose and they rage quit because it would cost too much (in terms of gold, time or NX) to make a replacement.
Most veterans have seen countless people rage quit over the years....what nexon/devcat doesn't seem to care is that this is contributing to a smaller playerbase and lower longterm profitability. It's like a restaurant surprise charging you for tap water on the bill...yea sure, you get more money straight up, but you lose customers in the long run.
I've lost count of the people I have seen that spend a massive amount of money on multiple outfits, cosmetic items, pets, etc, etc, that all rage quit because they blew their weapons up. Where are these people now? Playing games like BDO, blade and soul, TERA, etc....and not coming back. Most of them told me the same thing : they hate the permanent item destruction, the reliance on once in a month lucky drops to make any amount of gold, the focus on high enhanced weapons because +10 doesn't cut it anymore. One Lann that i know of blew up like 8 pairs of +10 spears permanently and now hates Nexon with a passion and I know a Kai who is on the verge of quitting because he can't make a +12 or higher crossgun despite failing like 6 times.
Look at BDO, they dont have permanent item destruction, yet they are making money that nexon can only dream about (from vindictus alone) and doing far more with player attraction and retention that Vindictus ever has.
Comments
seal shop is the main reason the game has gond down. i remember when seal shop has not been implemented yet the game is thriving lots of players are playing. but when it was implemented the game is hurting so much.
to think of it every time nexon puts the rare drops on the seal shop the economy of the game restart to zero then stabilize but every time they do this lots of players stops playing cause their hard earned armor set or rare items has become useless cause other players can get it easy.
.1 some one should start a pole if we should remove seal shop entirely
in my opinion if we want the game to keep getting better we should remove seal shop
this are just my own opinion and obervations. thanks
If you think someone should start a poll then why not do it yourself? The forums let you do this.
those are just my personal observations you can ignore or delete it anytime.
i dont want to start the pole cause i myself dont know if my personal ideas will help the game....
When prices on items are too high, where do players (the ones who don't like to play by the rules) go? They go to buy illegal gold from third parties. That's taking revenue away from Nexon. Its not just the spammers in Channels 1-5. There are lots of websites out there. Some gold is sold for cash by other players. But some of these are scammers; and scam sites. And that doesn't just hurt Nexon, it hurts the player too.
I'm hoping we can drive it down far enough that high enhance weapons can be purchased with gold from a single character. Gold cap being 2.1B per character means that a portion of the gold has to come from another character. It leaves the door wide open for players to be scammed. And we know there are scammers in this game. It's shameful, with the population as low as it is. But they don't care if players feelings are hurt, or they leave the game and never come back. Maybe Gold cap per char should be raised. That way the person trying to purchase the item can't be scammed.
I like this game as much as anyone. And I've had my fair share of luck, good and bad. And i have never bought gold and never will. But when you have to farm as much as I do(mine is the RNG that has gotten 3 scrolls in 2 whole years, yet I have 2 fully scrolled and very well-geared mains), you start to wonder if its worth it. Before I got a gnoll chieftain pet, I bought mine bombs 1000 at a time.
I think the best piece of advice comes from the player above( i dont read korean), is that Nexon NA needs to be more transparent and try harder to give players more full and complete disclosure. While I am understanding to an extent, I'm sure many players felt this was a slap to the face. Especially those first few who blew up gear and were shocked to see that they got nothing back.
The only really easy thing nexon could to to combat our inflation would be to dramatically increase all the drops of key items, or lower the number of mats needs/increase success rate. But then it would get to the point where folks don't bother using runes and of course nexon doesn't want to loose that $$.
Also, consider the fact that we're going to be fully merged with european servers soon. They'll leave the game entirely if they believe they'll be forced to deal with the problems that NA has refused to deal with in the past. You think its like this over there? Most r7 scrolls are under 10m.
As for folks not bothering to use runes, that happens now. Why do you think the prhase "YOLO" became so popular in this game? Allow me to direct you to youtube, where you can find videos of players trying to enhance 14 or more weapons from +10 at a time. Hell, the majority of old school players who are still left don't even bother with elixirs at brynns. R7? no brynns, if its gonna work its gonna work.
The only part of the picture i dont get is the gold bots....Back in october, before any of this happened, they spammed messages about $11USD/100m. Now that everything has gotten dramatically cheaper, they're spamming 29-31USD/100m. So, entire market got cheaper, and gold became more expensive? Just an observation- I still do, and will for always, not support or condone gold buying.
1) You are posting in a thread about ap restoring changes. (In particular the focus is on enhancing... enchanting never gave you mats, and unless enchant runes are cheap/event you usually only scroll after you manage a +10 or higher...)
2)The entire thread is from people saying they don't like the change. (30K ap to get back a weapon/blow it back up and get nothing in return stinks.)
3) Your first post was that you don't agree with the entire thread.
4) You then go on about inflation/rng/gold buying and who knows what... Which I pointed out has nothing to do with this thread, and if anything the new rules concerning restoring items make it so that 50% of the mats we used to get back is no longer possible, so they are in fact making inflation worse. (Note all items you got back weren't bound, so if you bought all items from seals... suddenly you had 4 more orange shards in the market instead of 2.)
5) I have no clue how ES etc related to the topic, hence I just stuck with inflation. We can chat offline if you really want to go into the dumb rng that is ES/Brynn. But we are not arguing that this RNG system is good... The thread is arguing that the last thing we want is to make RNG hurt us more.
6) Do you have any data behind your statements concerning YOLO? Because most everyone I know uses runes we get from buying airtight or events. From my experience one YOLOs if they don't care about the item... IE it isn't worth anything, it is already bound and they have one better, or they are going to stop playing. If they could get a bunch of gold from the item (like you are stating they could) then they wouldn't do it. (And usually it is that we start with 14 or more +10 weapons trying for a +15... that isn't YOLO that is the only way you have any good chance of a +13 let alone a +15.)
7) The EU server will start with 0 gold inflation. Go play on the Australia server and show me where all the gold is there. This issue is just a West/East problem. (Australia's problem is that if you want anything you have to farm it yourself, hence this ap restore change is again bad.)
This thread is just for folks to QQ about the fact that they can't get weapons back till they are lv 90 and that the second boom no longer gives you anything in return. And I guess the fast that there was no official notice about this change till this thread.
Have a wonderful day.
im sure there are real money ways to get what you want, but this whole system seems kinda weird to me. so my endgame would pretty much just be trying to retain a good weapon just to gamble it away with the next enchantment. im sure i didnt understand the system completely yet. but what i gathered so far is rly turning me off tbh
The permanent destruction is mainly when you try to enhance a weapon past +10 without special, very expensive, time limited runes. You can always use enchant runes to protect your gear.
In theory, you dont "need" to go beyond +10. In reality, the game massively encourages it. Attack speed and the attack cap mean that after you get your enchants sorted out, you pretty much need to go beyond +10 to improve your gear, especially for slow characters that need lots of attack speed. This is especailly true because bosses in season 2 and beyond are designed for parties near or at the attack cap...+10 level 60 weapons were sufficient for roch raids and was easy to get the mats for, +10 level 90 oj weapons without full enchants do nearly no damage in s3 raids and are much harder to make. People are therefore encouraged to gamble their weapons...more often than not, they lose and they rage quit because it would cost too much (in terms of gold, time or NX) to make a replacement.
Most veterans have seen countless people rage quit over the years....what nexon/devcat doesn't seem to care is that this is contributing to a smaller playerbase and lower longterm profitability. It's like a restaurant surprise charging you for tap water on the bill...yea sure, you get more money straight up, but you lose customers in the long run.
I've lost count of the people I have seen that spend a massive amount of money on multiple outfits, cosmetic items, pets, etc, etc, that all rage quit because they blew their weapons up. Where are these people now? Playing games like BDO, blade and soul, TERA, etc....and not coming back. Most of them told me the same thing : they hate the permanent item destruction, the reliance on once in a month lucky drops to make any amount of gold, the focus on high enhanced weapons because +10 doesn't cut it anymore. One Lann that i know of blew up like 8 pairs of +10 spears permanently and now hates Nexon with a passion and I know a Kai who is on the verge of quitting because he can't make a +12 or higher crossgun despite failing like 6 times.
Look at BDO, they dont have permanent item destruction, yet they are making money that nexon can only dream about (from vindictus alone) and doing far more with player attraction and retention that Vindictus ever has.